Hertsmere Borough Council given charter award (From Watford Observer)

I didn't even know we had an "East of England Local Government Association" nor a "a project manager from a public sector employers’ organisation".

Perhaps if we didn't, we might save some money. What do they actually do? It obviously isn't training and support, or they wouldn't need to be asking about it.
I bet there are some meaty pay-packets and expence accounts floating around though.

Excellent point, LSC! What on earth is "prestigious" about it? The whole concept of giving awards to people in local government is utter nonsense. As you so rightly say, what do they actually do to earn them? Don't they get paid for going to work and isn't that enough? Jobs for the boys, what?

Who appoints or elects the East of England Local Government Association? I don't recall ever being asked to vote for them! What is it? Who are they?

I might add that I have always thought the idea that Watford is part of the East of England is so utterly ludicrous as to be beneath contempt. Watford and the surrounding area of south-west Hertfordshire is very clearly linked with London and any other geographical entity is absurd.

Does anybody know anyone who commutes to work in Ipswich, Norwich, Colchester, Chelmsford, etc? What on earth do we have in common with fishermen in Norfolk or a bunch of swede-bashers in Suffolk?

These geographical arbitrary designations are just so much nonsense. All Watford's links are with London - workwise, socially, artistically, shopping, etc, etc, etc. East of England? Where's that?

What I'd say to both of you is hows about putting the thinking cap on instead of doing the easy, predictable, lazy public sector bashing that you seem fond of?

LSC I'm shocked that you would be against an organisation that promotes the economic, social, cultural well being of the area it represents. United they stand, divided they fall. There are so many issues which cross over geographical boundaries and its great that the East of England has a body which can put pressure on government, other public bodies, the private sector etc. for the good of the whole area when individually each borough could all too easily be ignored.

As to public sector employers organisation, that sounds a very roundabout way of saying Union.

Good old 'im all right Jack' Roy, out with guns blazing. Shame you loaded blanks once again! Good thing mind you as your aim is so poor.

Firstly I don’t think a former hack should be making any comments 'about jobs for the boys', your former employers/line of work isn't too reticent in handing out self congratulatory pats on the back as well as awards to the ever increasing number of non celebrities they have become obsessed with.

There IS nothing wrong with being recognised for a job well done regardless (almost) what field of work you're in. Seeing as cllr's perform such a vital role in their local communities then it is important that they receive training so that they can better serve those they represent. I'd rather those that provide the training be recognised than some red top giving an award to a soap star or one of its own reporters when for instance they've sat for decades on one of the biggest scandals involving a celebrity this country has ever seen (whilst happily hacking the phone of the said above non entities for title tattle).

And unless your question was rhetorical about the East of England Local government association I do have to wonder again about your journalistic skills and sense of reasoning. Still working for papers that were more interested in buses on the moon etc probably investigative ability came far down the list of skills they wanted from an employee.

Oh, and run a ruler down the middle of England and you'll find that Herts is in the Eastern part. Our proximity to London doesn’t change that and you'll probably find that governing Watford for instance is far more akin to governing Norwich than it is to a London borough. Its ludicrous that you've mixed up governance with culture and totally ignored geography!

Actually, Tony, old son, you're the one who invariably gets your facts wrong! The "buses on the moon" story was created by The Sunday Sport, a paper which I never had anything remotely to do with and which was only established in 1986 whereas the one to which you are referring was founded in 1843 and never wrote a story about a bus on the moon in its entire existence. Still, you're so ignorant you just have to have a little sneer, don't you?

I believe the East of England authority, whatever it's called, has its headquarters in Bury St Edmunds. What that has to do with Watford I couldn't say. It is surely blindingly obvious that virtually all Watford's commercial, social, business, entertainment links are with London. Thousands of people commute into the capital from Watford every day for work. You could argue the eastern half of Hertfordshire is in the East of England (Bishops Stortford and Stevenage) but Watford is in south-west Herts and certainly is not.

I will say it again - I don't see why local government employees and councillors should expect awards simply for doing a job for which they are being paid (and councillors get allowances) any more than civil servants should expect to feature in the honours list.

In all the dealings I've ever had with local councils, whether professionally or privately, I have usually found them incompetent and taking about 4 times as long to do something as people in private business and commerce.

The majority of people working in town halls are just robots with clipboards!

Thanks for the history lesson Roy, I was of course talking in general terms about your former profession. But never mind hey, if it brought back fond memories of 1843 for you then I'm glad for you.

The East of England association is for county councils and as I said before it therefore does have more in common with the rest of the East of England than London. Something you half agreed with, so there's hope for you yet.

As to people 'expecting' awards, who said they expected anything. Its hardly Jane Does fault if she is doing a job which someone else decides to evaluate and compare with others doing similar work. I'm sure no one when looking for work has as their criteria the need for a nationally recognised award in their sector. But ultimately there is nothing wrong with people being recognised for good work, it gives them a fillip I'm sure and gives others ideas on best practise in their field. Win win really, the only losers are those that somehow want to use it as a stick to bash public bodies with for their own ridiculous petty reasons.

And in my dealings with local authorities and many other public bodies I've almost always found them to be professional, courteious and providing a good service. What I don’t have of course is a chip on my shoulder colouring my judgement. The only robots are those that moan about public workers without any real need.

As a former committee member of a residents' association, I can still remember the despair we went through a few years ago when dealing with Watford Council. All we wanted was to be allowed to use the premises of a council-owned bowls club once a month for our meetings. Files got lost and the person we were supposed to be dealing with was constantly changing, so we had to start all over again. Then the legal department got involved and that was that! The saga dragged on for something like three years until we finally threw up our hands and walked away.

The problem with local authorities is...

1) They're throttled by red tape and bureaucracy.

2) The salaries they pay, at least lower down the scale, are not adequate enough to attract people of sufficient ability and intelligence, but it's a real problem trying to get rid of them when they turn out to be incompetent.

3) They like to boast about handling large budgets but local councils don't actually produce any wealth. All they do is impose compulsory taxation which we have to pay, whereas if private businesses fail they go to the wall.

garston tony wrote:
LSC I'm shocked that you would be against an organisation that promotes the economic, social, cultural well being of the area it represents. United they stand, divided they fall. There are so many issues which cross over geographical boundaries and its great that the East of England has a body which can put pressure on government, other public bodies, the private sector etc. for the good of the whole area when individually each borough could all too easily be ignored.

As to public sector employers organisation, that sounds a very roundabout way of saying Union.

But if I have never heard of them, how much good are they doing me?
Besides, I don't reside in the East of England. I live within the M25. Ok, if you take Cornwall into account, I'm more geographically East than West. But then if you take the Outer Hebredies into account, I'm very, very South.
East of England is Ipswich, and I have as much in common from someone from there as I do Manchester or Cardiff.
So what's the point?

Quite so. Why do we need an additional layer of local government, anyway, when we already have a county council and local councils in Watford, Hertsmere and Three Rivers? What precisely does the East of England Loal Government Association DO that affects any of us?

Roy Stockdill wrote:
As a former committee member of a residents' association, I can still remember the despair we went through a few years ago when dealing with Watford Council. All we wanted was to be allowed to use the premises of a council-owned bowls club once a month for our meetings. Files got lost and the person we were supposed to be dealing with was constantly changing, so we had to start all over again. Then the legal department got involved and that was that! The saga dragged on for something like three years until we finally threw up our hands and walked away. The problem with local authorities is... 1) They're throttled by red tape and bureaucracy. 2) The salaries they pay, at least lower down the scale, are not adequate enough to attract people of sufficient ability and intelligence, but it's a real problem trying to get rid of them when they turn out to be incompetent. 3) They like to boast about handling large budgets but local councils don't actually produce any wealth. All they do is impose compulsory taxation which we have to pay, whereas if private businesses fail they go to the wall.

So you've had one experience which wasn’t good and that means every one that works for a local authority is bad. Hmm, not sound reasoning there. That’s like saying all journalist present and past were involved in phone hacking and covering up the activities of a certain celebrity monster.

If they are throttled by red tape blame those that generate it not those that have to battle with it every day of their working lives.

Disagree to a large part, in my many dealings (not just one Roy incident, many) with local authorities over the years I've dealt with intelligent and committed individuals who have provided a good service. Are there going to be bad eggs, of course that is the law of averages and that applies to private sector organisations (the press for instance) that you wish to praise so much.

Local authorities arent there to create wealth, they are there to provide a large number of diverse services to their communities.

LSC wrote:

garston tony wrote: LSC I'm shocked that you would be against an organisation that promotes the economic, social, cultural well being of the area it represents. United they stand, divided they fall. There are so many issues which cross over geographical boundaries and its great that the East of England has a body which can put pressure on government, other public bodies, the private sector etc. for the good of the whole area when individually each borough could all too easily be ignored. As to public sector employers organisation, that sounds a very roundabout way of saying Union.

But if I have never heard of them, how much good are they doing me? Besides, I don't reside in the East of England. I live within the M25. Ok, if you take Cornwall into account, I'm more geographically East than West. But then if you take the Outer Hebredies into account, I'm very, very South. East of England is Ipswich, and I have as much in common from someone from there as I do Manchester or Cardiff. So what's the point?

LSC why do you need to have heard of something for it to be of benefit to you? Its perfectly possible for there to be organisations going about their business without your knowledge but whose work benefits you!

And geographically we are south and east but still in the eastern part of the country. There would be no point Herts CC being lumped in with a London association of local authorities as you two seem to wish because those boroughs face totally different challenges to our county which in terms of governance and management and needs has far more in common with Suffolk for instance hence why its part of the East of England association. Seriously, is it that hard to get that?

Roy Stockdill wrote:
Quite so. Why do we need an additional layer of local government, anyway, when we already have a county council and local councils in Watford, Hertsmere and Three Rivers? What precisely does the East of England Loal Government Association DO that affects any of us?

Roy by your reasoning, why have a county council or a national government? Lets get all medieval and have city states ruled by despots each with its own way of doing thing, raising armies to over come the challenges they encounter…...

WBC looks after the needs of Watford residents. Sometimes those needs are best met in conjunction with other authorities, sometimes there is a need for a more strategic vision hence say WBC's tie up with Three Rivers and the County council which provides joined up thinking on transport, schools, police and the needs of the county as a whole. And sometimes the needs of the county as a whole are best met in conjunction with other counties or indeed a national government hence why local government associations and indeed a national government.

As usual you've put no thought into your attacks and you're just bashing something for the sake of it

Personally, I suspect the idea of a tier of local government for the East of England is part and parcel of the EEC's obsession with regionalisation and its long-term desire to abolish ENGLAND altogether as a separate and independent country and break it down into separate regions.

The oafish blatherer John Prescott got a very short and sharp reply from the voters of Newcastle and surrounding area when he tried to impose a regional government onto them.

In the words of the old patriotic song, "There'll always be an England". It will be interesting to see what happens to Scotland if by some mishap they do vote for Scottish independence. Let them get on with it, say I! I reckon they'll be begging us to take them back again within a couple of years!