Curfew for teenager who damaged submarine float after drinking session

The purple submarine in the pond

The purple submarine in the pond

First published in News by

A teenager has appeared in court after drunkenly attacking a submarine float in the pond, which celebrated an award for the management of the Watford’s nightlife.

Daniel Savage, 19, admitted damaging the model outside Oceana nightclub and has been ordered to attend a Drinkwise course and stay in at night.

He was also ordered not to go to any place where alcohol is served from 6pm until the beginning of the New Year and must stay in his home between 10pm and 4am.

Prosecutor Laura Blackband told St Albans Crown Court today that Savage kicked the submarine float before being chased down the High Street by officers, who arrested him.

Savage, of Rushton Avenue, Watford, pleaded guilty to damaging the float following a heavy drinking session.

In a letter he wrote to the judge he said that he was very drunk and was now "very sorry" for his actions.

He said he ran away from police because at the time he was under a suspended sentence.

Judge John Plumstead told Savage said: "Unless you get your drinking under control, you will keep causing harm. You have made a fool of yourself with this crime."

In addition to the curfew, Savage will have to complete a Drinkwise course and was sentenced to a 12 month community order. The 21 month suspended sentence he was serving has been extended by three months.

The submarine appeared in the pond after Watford won a purple flag award, which recognises good management of night time economies.

The town received the accolade in September after Watford Borough Council applied for it.

It was officially unveiled outside town hall at a ceremony attended by dignitaries from the town hall, Hertfordshire Constabulary and various clubs and pubs.

Comments (24)

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3:48pm Mon 19 Nov 12

generalchaos says...

Where is Rushden Avenue ?
Where is Rushden Avenue ? generalchaos
  • Score: 0

4:06pm Mon 19 Nov 12

TRT says...

Good question. Must be new. The only place like that that I can think of that sounds like that is Rushton Avenue. Maybe it's a stenographer's mistake coupled with lazy reporting?
Good question. Must be new. The only place like that that I can think of that sounds like that is Rushton Avenue. Maybe it's a stenographer's mistake coupled with lazy reporting? TRT
  • Score: 0

4:28pm Mon 19 Nov 12

wd40 says...

'The submarine appeared in the pond after Watford won a purple flag award, which recognises good management of night time economies.'

Ironic. Love it.
'The submarine appeared in the pond after Watford won a purple flag award, which recognises good management of night time economies.' Ironic. Love it. wd40
  • Score: 0

5:01pm Mon 19 Nov 12

LSC says...

I'd love to say something constructive. But I can't.
I'd love to say something constructive. But I can't. LSC
  • Score: 0

6:01pm Mon 19 Nov 12

mister says...

exactly the kind of nugget who will gleefully tear up the 4m bridge!!!
exactly the kind of nugget who will gleefully tear up the 4m bridge!!! mister
  • Score: 0

8:49pm Mon 19 Nov 12

pepsiman says...

Muppet. Typical of pond life we have today
Muppet. Typical of pond life we have today pepsiman
  • Score: 0

9:31pm Mon 19 Nov 12

Reg Edit says...

Don't drunken people realise how important the purple flag is to Watford and what an asset it is to the town?

Why, without purple flags and submarines, where would Watford be?

Purple submarines eh? I thank the drunken teenager for bringing to my attention the totally ridiculous idea that Watford paid to have it's own purple submarine.

You just couldn't make it up. Ridiculous! Where do the Liberals stop with their self-glorification? Purple submarines? Ridiculous!
Don't drunken people realise how important the purple flag is to Watford and what an asset it is to the town? Why, without purple flags and submarines, where would Watford be? Purple submarines eh? I thank the drunken teenager for bringing to my attention the totally ridiculous idea that Watford paid to have it's own purple submarine. You just couldn't make it up. Ridiculous! Where do the Liberals stop with their self-glorification? Purple submarines? Ridiculous! Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

10:07pm Mon 19 Nov 12

LSC says...

Out of interest, who paid for the purple submarine? I know we paid for the flag, and we paid for the people to turn up and present the flag, and we paid for people to come and have a jolly to fill out the paperwork to get the flag, but nobody mentioned sub-aquatics as part of the deal.
Out of interest, who paid for the purple submarine? I know we paid for the flag, and we paid for the people to turn up and present the flag, and we paid for people to come and have a jolly to fill out the paperwork to get the flag, but nobody mentioned sub-aquatics as part of the deal. LSC
  • Score: 0

11:30pm Mon 19 Nov 12

gazmondo says...

i prefer a yellow submarine
i prefer a yellow submarine gazmondo
  • Score: 0

8:47am Tue 20 Nov 12

WatfordBandB says...

Water load of nonsense
Water load of nonsense WatfordBandB
  • Score: 0

9:02am Tue 20 Nov 12

Reg Edit says...

gazmondo wrote:
i prefer a yellow submarine
Gazmondo has rumbled the Liberal's little plan! It's another dirty trick by the Lib Dems, painting it in UKIP colours to discredit our great party.
Disgraceful I say!!!

We all know it's really a yellow submarine underneath, piloted by Captain Dotty herself, bravely going where only ducks have dared to go before and in the process making a laughing stock of herself for yet another stupid folly. I hope this one didn't cost 5 million, eh Dotty?

Our official Watford UKIP line is we will never use taxpayers money (our money) to put a submarine (of any colour) in the pond to glorify ourselves or our party. We will instead use taxpayers money wisely and try to reduce (not hold, but reduce) council taxes by cutting out this sort of waste, this sort of tat that is no use to man nor beast.

I do believe the man in question represented us all when he delivered his verdict on the council submarine. Had there been a bridge over the pond I believe a drunken man could have delivered an even more accurate assessment of our opinion on this jolly little dotty folly. What's that? Oh yes, Dotty's going to build a bridge isn't she? She really does think of everything to help the nightbirds in the town to express themselves.

If you're fed up of silly Liberal follies, check out UKIP, we're just not into wasting money like the other parties and no-one wants to pay more tax than they have to.
[quote][p][bold]gazmondo[/bold] wrote: i prefer a yellow submarine[/p][/quote]Gazmondo has rumbled the Liberal's little plan! It's another dirty trick by the Lib Dems, painting it in UKIP colours to discredit our great party. Disgraceful I say!!! We all know it's really a yellow submarine underneath, piloted by Captain Dotty herself, bravely going where only ducks have dared to go before and in the process making a laughing stock of herself for yet another stupid folly. I hope this one didn't cost 5 million, eh Dotty? Our official Watford UKIP line is we will never use taxpayers money (our money) to put a submarine (of any colour) in the pond to glorify ourselves or our party. We will instead use taxpayers money wisely and try to reduce (not hold, but reduce) council taxes by cutting out this sort of waste, this sort of tat that is no use to man nor beast. I do believe the man in question represented us all when he delivered his verdict on the council submarine. Had there been a bridge over the pond I believe a drunken man could have delivered an even more accurate assessment of our opinion on this jolly little dotty folly. What's that? Oh yes, Dotty's going to build a bridge isn't she? She really does think of everything to help the nightbirds in the town to express themselves. If you're fed up of silly Liberal follies, check out UKIP, we're just not into wasting money like the other parties and no-one wants to pay more tax than they have to. Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

9:08am Tue 20 Nov 12

Mike Watford says...

LSC wrote:
Out of interest, who paid for the purple submarine? I know we paid for the flag, and we paid for the people to turn up and present the flag, and we paid for people to come and have a jolly to fill out the paperwork to get the flag, but nobody mentioned sub-aquatics as part of the deal.
A local charity made it for free.

Actually the town didn't 'pay for the flag'. It paid to see if it would qualify for Purple Flag - and some places don't succeed.

Independent outside assessors come to a town for themselves to see if it is good enough, and then an action plan has to be drawn up to make the area better.
(Presumably only in Watford would people run their own town down after it has been successful)
[quote][p][bold]LSC[/bold] wrote: Out of interest, who paid for the purple submarine? I know we paid for the flag, and we paid for the people to turn up and present the flag, and we paid for people to come and have a jolly to fill out the paperwork to get the flag, but nobody mentioned sub-aquatics as part of the deal.[/p][/quote]A local charity made it for free. Actually the town didn't 'pay for the flag'. It paid to see if it would qualify for Purple Flag - and some places don't succeed. Independent outside assessors come to a town for themselves to see if it is good enough, and then an action plan has to be drawn up to make the area better. (Presumably only in Watford would people run their own town down after it has been successful) Mike Watford
  • Score: 0

9:39am Tue 20 Nov 12

Reg Edit says...

Mike Watford wrote:
LSC wrote:
Out of interest, who paid for the purple submarine? I know we paid for the flag, and we paid for the people to turn up and present the flag, and we paid for people to come and have a jolly to fill out the paperwork to get the flag, but nobody mentioned sub-aquatics as part of the deal.
A local charity made it for free.

Actually the town didn't 'pay for the flag'. It paid to see if it would qualify for Purple Flag - and some places don't succeed.

Independent outside assessors come to a town for themselves to see if it is good enough, and then an action plan has to be drawn up to make the area better.
(Presumably only in Watford would people run their own town down after it has been successful)
Presumably only in a Liberal town would the council be so pleased to get an award they clearly paid for.

Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council?

Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this flag?

Come on Mike, I know you know the answers. Share them with us.
[quote][p][bold]Mike Watford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]LSC[/bold] wrote: Out of interest, who paid for the purple submarine? I know we paid for the flag, and we paid for the people to turn up and present the flag, and we paid for people to come and have a jolly to fill out the paperwork to get the flag, but nobody mentioned sub-aquatics as part of the deal.[/p][/quote]A local charity made it for free. Actually the town didn't 'pay for the flag'. It paid to see if it would qualify for Purple Flag - and some places don't succeed. Independent outside assessors come to a town for themselves to see if it is good enough, and then an action plan has to be drawn up to make the area better. (Presumably only in Watford would people run their own town down after it has been successful)[/p][/quote]Presumably only in a Liberal town would the council be so pleased to get an award they clearly paid for. Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council? Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this flag? Come on Mike, I know you know the answers. Share them with us. Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

11:52am Tue 20 Nov 12

Sanity 750 says...

It’s a fine looking submarine. How heart warming that a local charity would make such an object.
It’s a fine looking submarine. How heart warming that a local charity would make such an object. Sanity 750
  • Score: 0

11:55am Tue 20 Nov 12

Sanity 750 says...

But why would a charity make it for such a politically motivated stunt?
But why would a charity make it for such a politically motivated stunt? Sanity 750
  • Score: 0

12:08pm Tue 20 Nov 12

Reg Edit says...

Can any charity put their stuff in the pond?

I know a charity with some old stereos they want to get rid of. Shall I let them know?

Sounds all a bit political to me, something which charities are meant to avoid, or has Mike just made that up about it being a charity to deflect criticism of Dotty?
Can any charity put their stuff in the pond? I know a charity with some old stereos they want to get rid of. Shall I let them know? Sounds all a bit political to me, something which charities are meant to avoid, or has Mike just made that up about it being a charity to deflect criticism of Dotty? Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

12:16pm Tue 20 Nov 12

LSC says...

Mike Watford wrote:
LSC wrote:
Out of interest, who paid for the purple submarine? I know we paid for the flag, and we paid for the people to turn up and present the flag, and we paid for people to come and have a jolly to fill out the paperwork to get the flag, but nobody mentioned sub-aquatics as part of the deal.
A local charity made it for free.

Actually the town didn't 'pay for the flag'. It paid to see if it would qualify for Purple Flag - and some places don't succeed.

Independent outside assessors come to a town for themselves to see if it is good enough, and then an action plan has to be drawn up to make the area better.
(Presumably only in Watford would people run their own town down after it has been successful)
Who wasn't successful? For crying out loud, Londonderry/Derry has one! A town in such a state of virtual civil war it can't agree it's own name!
If you walk into the wrong pub, say goodbye to your kneecaps.

So tell me, where was worse that they didn't qualify?
[quote][p][bold]Mike Watford[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]LSC[/bold] wrote: Out of interest, who paid for the purple submarine? I know we paid for the flag, and we paid for the people to turn up and present the flag, and we paid for people to come and have a jolly to fill out the paperwork to get the flag, but nobody mentioned sub-aquatics as part of the deal.[/p][/quote]A local charity made it for free. Actually the town didn't 'pay for the flag'. It paid to see if it would qualify for Purple Flag - and some places don't succeed. Independent outside assessors come to a town for themselves to see if it is good enough, and then an action plan has to be drawn up to make the area better. (Presumably only in Watford would people run their own town down after it has been successful)[/p][/quote]Who wasn't successful? For crying out loud, Londonderry/Derry has one! A town in such a state of virtual civil war it can't agree it's own name! If you walk into the wrong pub, say goodbye to your kneecaps. So tell me, where was worse that they didn't qualify? LSC
  • Score: 0

4:22pm Tue 20 Nov 12

Reg Edit says...

Mike Watford, we are still waiting for your answers about the charity, purple submarine and flag in my earlier post.

Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council?

Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this flag?

Sanity also raised some interesting questions.

Mike, are you still there?
Mike Watford, we are still waiting for your answers about the charity, purple submarine and flag in my earlier post. Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council? Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this flag? Sanity also raised some interesting questions. Mike, are you still there? Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

5:41pm Tue 20 Nov 12

LuthersLoveChild says...

What exactlyis the point of a suspended sentence if it isn't enforced when the terms are broken?
What exactlyis the point of a suspended sentence if it isn't enforced when the terms are broken? LuthersLoveChild
  • Score: 0

7:30am Wed 21 Nov 12

Reg Edit says...

LuthersLoveChild wrote:
What exactlyis the point of a suspended sentence if it isn't enforced when the terms are broken?
Would you send someone to jail for
kicking a purple submarine after a few drinks?

Now let's get back to the important questions that Mike Watford doesn't want to answer.

Mike Watford

Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council?

Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this purple flag?

Mike's gone really quiet on this one. Mike? Mike? Where are you? Answer please. Dotty? Are you there? Peter Jeffree? Any of you able to answer?
[quote][p][bold]LuthersLoveChild[/bold] wrote: What exactlyis the point of a suspended sentence if it isn't enforced when the terms are broken?[/p][/quote]Would you send someone to jail for kicking a purple submarine after a few drinks? Now let's get back to the important questions that Mike Watford doesn't want to answer. Mike Watford Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council? Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this purple flag? Mike's gone really quiet on this one. Mike? Mike? Where are you? Answer please. Dotty? Are you there? Peter Jeffree? Any of you able to answer? Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

8:43am Wed 21 Nov 12

LuthersLoveChild says...

Reg Edit wrote:
LuthersLoveChild wrote:
What exactlyis the point of a suspended sentence if it isn't enforced when the terms are broken?
Would you send someone to jail for
kicking a purple submarine after a few drinks?

Now let's get back to the important questions that Mike Watford doesn't want to answer.

Mike Watford

Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council?

Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this purple flag?

Mike's gone really quiet on this one. Mike? Mike? Where are you? Answer please. Dotty? Are you there? Peter Jeffree? Any of you able to answer?
Er, I would if they had already been given a suspended sentence Reg. The whole point of a suspended sentence is to keep you on the straight and narrow, a last chance. You're fully aware that any indiscretion will lead to incarceration. If this submarine is in the middle of the pond, he's had to jump in and wade across to smack it? its not quite the same as sticking a leg out while walking past.

the "few drinks" is all relative. He is an adult and should be able to manage his intake as well as face the consequences for his actions
[quote][p][bold]Reg Edit[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]LuthersLoveChild[/bold] wrote: What exactlyis the point of a suspended sentence if it isn't enforced when the terms are broken?[/p][/quote]Would you send someone to jail for kicking a purple submarine after a few drinks? Now let's get back to the important questions that Mike Watford doesn't want to answer. Mike Watford Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council? Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this purple flag? Mike's gone really quiet on this one. Mike? Mike? Where are you? Answer please. Dotty? Are you there? Peter Jeffree? Any of you able to answer?[/p][/quote]Er, I would if they had already been given a suspended sentence Reg. The whole point of a suspended sentence is to keep you on the straight and narrow, a last chance. You're fully aware that any indiscretion will lead to incarceration. If this submarine is in the middle of the pond, he's had to jump in and wade across to smack it? its not quite the same as sticking a leg out while walking past. the "few drinks" is all relative. He is an adult and should be able to manage his intake as well as face the consequences for his actions LuthersLoveChild
  • Score: 0

9:13am Wed 21 Nov 12

Reg Edit says...

LuthersLoveChild wrote:
Reg Edit wrote:
LuthersLoveChild wrote:
What exactlyis the point of a suspended sentence if it isn't enforced when the terms are broken?
Would you send someone to jail for
kicking a purple submarine after a few drinks?

Now let's get back to the important questions that Mike Watford doesn't want to answer.

Mike Watford

Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council?

Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this purple flag?

Mike's gone really quiet on this one. Mike? Mike? Where are you? Answer please. Dotty? Are you there? Peter Jeffree? Any of you able to answer?
Er, I would if they had already been given a suspended sentence Reg. The whole point of a suspended sentence is to keep you on the straight and narrow, a last chance. You're fully aware that any indiscretion will lead to incarceration. If this submarine is in the middle of the pond, he's had to jump in and wade across to smack it? its not quite the same as sticking a leg out while walking past.

the "few drinks" is all relative. He is an adult and should be able to manage his intake as well as face the consequences for his actions
I see what you're saying but I still disagree I'm afraid. If the original charge was not sufficient for him to go to prison over, then this further misdemeanour should not be enough to push him in to jail either. It really is "much ado about nothing". Where is the police sense of humour and proportion? Let's hope the new part-time commissioner does something about that.

If the purple submarine was in the middle of the pond then I don't know how he could have kicked it, so although the picture shows it in the middle of the pond, I suspect it was near the side and was a tempting target of drunken bravado, although it is clear neither of us have the facts about its positioning. Perhaps Dotty's Captain's log will give us exact co-ordinates, heading, depth and speed at the time of the attack?

I stick by my earlier remarks that a kick at a pathetic political purple submarine is not an imprisonable offence and not sufficient grounds to send someone to prison over. For me it really is as simple as that.

There is the other issue of course that many people are not imprisoned who should be and are put on suspended sentences, but that as I say is another issue entirely.

I really could not keep a straight face if asked why this man was in prison and had to explain "Whilst drunk he kicked a purple submarine what was floating in a pond". Could you?
[quote][p][bold]LuthersLoveChild[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Reg Edit[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]LuthersLoveChild[/bold] wrote: What exactlyis the point of a suspended sentence if it isn't enforced when the terms are broken?[/p][/quote]Would you send someone to jail for kicking a purple submarine after a few drinks? Now let's get back to the important questions that Mike Watford doesn't want to answer. Mike Watford Why is a local charity paying for a purple submarine? What local charity is it? Does the local charity by any chance get a grant or any form of payment and support from the council? Can you name me one worthwhile benefit to the town that has come directly from paying for this purple flag? Mike's gone really quiet on this one. Mike? Mike? Where are you? Answer please. Dotty? Are you there? Peter Jeffree? Any of you able to answer?[/p][/quote]Er, I would if they had already been given a suspended sentence Reg. The whole point of a suspended sentence is to keep you on the straight and narrow, a last chance. You're fully aware that any indiscretion will lead to incarceration. If this submarine is in the middle of the pond, he's had to jump in and wade across to smack it? its not quite the same as sticking a leg out while walking past. the "few drinks" is all relative. He is an adult and should be able to manage his intake as well as face the consequences for his actions[/p][/quote]I see what you're saying but I still disagree I'm afraid. If the original charge was not sufficient for him to go to prison over, then this further misdemeanour should not be enough to push him in to jail either. It really is "much ado about nothing". Where is the police sense of humour and proportion? Let's hope the new part-time commissioner does something about that. If the purple submarine was in the middle of the pond then I don't know how he could have kicked it, so although the picture shows it in the middle of the pond, I suspect it was near the side and was a tempting target of drunken bravado, although it is clear neither of us have the facts about its positioning. Perhaps Dotty's Captain's log will give us exact co-ordinates, heading, depth and speed at the time of the attack? I stick by my earlier remarks that a kick at a pathetic political purple submarine is not an imprisonable offence and not sufficient grounds to send someone to prison over. For me it really is as simple as that. There is the other issue of course that many people are not imprisoned who should be and are put on suspended sentences, but that as I say is another issue entirely. I really could not keep a straight face if asked why this man was in prison and had to explain "Whilst drunk he kicked a purple submarine what was floating in a pond". Could you? Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

11:02pm Wed 21 Nov 12

Reg Edit says...

Mike Watford - Cat got your tongue?
Mike Watford - Cat got your tongue? Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

8:20pm Fri 23 Nov 12

Reg Edit says...

It seems Mike has run out of whitewash.

I'm sure the Liberals will buy another tanker-load from our taxes - they couldn't live without it.
It seems Mike has run out of whitewash. I'm sure the Liberals will buy another tanker-load from our taxes - they couldn't live without it. Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

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