Residents call for ban on booze licences (From Watford Observer)

What's going on? Has Dotty's purple flag stopped working?

Time for a council that cares about all of Watford, not just the Cassiobury.

At least the Eastern European pub has closed that was full non European p:ss heads. hail the purple helmet protector of all.

The costs of maintaining this drink culture goes way beyond the extra policing and clean up 'litter' direct costs. It affects employers who have to cope with inefficient staff still sobering up from a late night, the noise pollution from revellers as locals try to sleep, the higher insurance premiums residents have to pay for their cars prone to damage, the reduction in house values, and not forgetting the now regularly accepted use of the most foul invectives all adds up to unmeasureable social costs to society.

wow the above report makes out that there are fights and policed called everyday and that just isn't the case. Shouldn't people be complaining about the half way houses that kick people out during the day that then go to the other shops in Queens Road and buy cheap alcohol,in fact isn't one of the people in the photo a person who runs one of the said shops.....mmmm if so i wonder why she is complaining??! And as for the comments above....E.Coli who on earth are you talking about??? and Mohandas are you commenting generally on the social state of the contry or specifically about Queens Road??! most of the people that buy from the shops don't actaully have jobs and live in the areas sheltered accomodation or in bedsits in Gladstone Road. So then who has kicked up a fuss about the amount of fast food shops in Queens Road, I think you wil find that these are the places that attract people after a night out and this is where you get 99% of your anti-social behaviour. However having had first had experience of Polish drinking and habits I agree that giving a Polish shop and alcohol license is probably a bad idea.

I see Su Murray is taking a leading role in this - she missed out being elected at the last by-election.

Where are the ward councillors and what are they doing about it? It is for them and the police to fix this.

I do think it is a bit rich that the shopkeepers selling booze are getting in on the protests. If they felt that strongly about it they would be calling for a ban on all shops selling alcohol, including their own, or is it a case of pulling up the drawbridge once they were safely inside?

Regardless, something must be done to tackle this problem and I wish Su every success with her campaign.

>>>>in fact isn't one of the people in the photo a person who runs one of the said shops..... mmmm if so i wonder why she is complaining??!


If that is true, it does seems that this might be more about keeping her business selling alcohol profitably, than anything else?

No Mike, there really is a problem there, any idiot can see that. The fact some protesters may have duplicitous motives does not remove that fact.

Maybe Dotty should get off her backside and do something about it instead of popping up in every other WO story saying what a wonderful town it is and how wonderful it is to have a purple flag showing how lovely and safe the town is. Clearly the purple flag doesn't work in Queens Road and it's Dotty's job (because she's the mayor for all of Watford, not just the easy bits) to sort it out.

Plain enough?

Where's that new Lib Dem councillor for Central who runs a cafe in the same road? Is she doing anything?

(1) Queens Road is part of the open alcohol ban area which doesn't seem to be enforced,
(2) There's a fair bit of trouble on Queen's Road now which has become worse and worse over the last 22 years that I've lived there.
(3) The half-way house has closed down now.
(4) Respectable businesses that have operated in the area for over 30 years and are an established part of the community probably feel, quite rightly, that their business will suffer in the face of excessive competition: only £x pounds coming in, divided by y shops, someone's going to lose out, and the survivors are likely to be chain stores and those engaged in dodgy dealings (bootlegging, paying below minimum wage, excessive working hours, illegal workers, poor hygiene, low fridge maintenance etc). So when it's ONLY Dodgski Cashovitch and Couldn't Care Less Cost Cutters left on the street, who don't know or don't care that little Freddy whom they've seen come into the shop in a pushchair, first steps to reach up for a chocolate bar, first solo trip to get milk, but now wants to buy cigs and Vodka but surely is only 15, then yes, there is a problem, and one which it is quite right to draw attention to in the press.

srfc wrote:
wow the above report makes out that there are fights and policed called everyday and that just isn't the case. Shouldn't people be complaining about the half way houses that kick people out during the day that then go to the other shops in Queens Road and buy cheap alcohol,in fact isn't one of the people in the photo a person who runs one of the said shops.....mmmm if so i wonder why she is complaining??! And as for the comments above....E.Coli who on earth are you talking about??? and Mohandas are you commenting generally on the social state of the contry or specifically about Queens Road??! most of the people that buy from the shops don't actaully have jobs and live in the areas sheltered accomodation or in bedsits in Gladstone Road. So then who has kicked up a fuss about the amount of fast food shops in Queens Road, I think you wil find that these are the places that attract people after a night out and this is where you get 99% of your anti-social behaviour. However having had first had experience of Polish drinking and habits I agree that giving a Polish shop and alcohol license is probably a bad idea.

It seems you have NO idea what goes on in this area. That half way house has been 'closed' since last year. So you're out of touch!!.. And get your facts straight.

Local councillor and the council has so far in their 10 years of control, have refused to bring in local bye-laws which wont just help this area but other area of Watford too.. Helen Lynch Fib Dems is fully aware of the antisocial behaviour in the area. But so far since she been a councillor has done NOTHING about it, just pass it on to let someone else deal with it. Helen also decide to make The Broadway & Queens Rd by part of the town, so she can get funding for 'her' market which doesn't help or bring trade into the area. The idea of making this area be part of the town was against many local residents views. But like many things, Helen does what she wants to do even if everybody else doesn't want or against it. Similar what Dottie does.

TRT, everywhere and everything has changed over the last 22 years....is there really 'excessive competition' for 2nd hand guitars, afro caribbean hair dressers or motor bike shops in the area? The convenience shop owners (as licensees) have a duty of care not to sell to the already intoxicated or sell to under age or even cigarettes to youngsters that is where people need to start looking....closer to home! The premises where the new polish shop has been vacate for years and who on earth decided to put a fine antiques shop in the area, I guess there must be a need for it!!??

srfc wrote:
TRT, everywhere and everything has changed over the last 22 years....is there really 'excessive competition' for 2nd hand guitars, afro caribbean hair dressers or motor bike shops in the area? The convenience shop owners (as licensees) have a duty of care not to sell to the already intoxicated or sell to under age or even cigarettes to youngsters that is where people need to start looking....closer to home! The premises where the new polish shop has been vacate for years and who on earth decided to put a fine antiques shop in the area, I guess there must be a need for it!!??

"FIne Antiques"? Are you having a laugh?

Anyone who knows anything about the background of the proprietor of this establishment wouldn't touch it with a barge pole.

@srfc. I suspect that you didn't read what I wrote. To reiterate... probably feel, quite rightly, that their business will suffer in the face of excessive competition.

I did not say that there was excessive competition, simply that business would be right to fear such.

I also did not say anything about things changing over the last 22 years, but I did say that they have got worse. Do we stand by and accept a gradual slide into lawlessness, drunken behaviour and a culture of fear?

It's strange that the people of Watford have for years, always voted for Liberal left ideas - But when Liberal left ideas became visible (ie, high immigration, freedom to do what you want, less of those horrible police, softer sentencing, softer on drug use) everyone moans!

Hypocrisy!

Many of us for a number of years now have been saying that the council needs to take the lead (not necessarilly the same as paying for all the investment), in imoproving Queens Road/Broadway. They could zone the properrty for redevelopment, encouraging new uses for buildings. They could work with Harlequin owners to make The Broadway a services area for the Shopping centre. The council should work with landowners and the Housing Trust to get investment in the flats above the shops. Many are terrible and as a result attract tenants who have few choices. They need to work withn the Police to tackle the overt drug dealing that seems to have developed since the new flats have opened at the top of Loates Lane. The closure of the stonham hostel has shown that it alone was not the sole source of trouble.

I thought there were 2 councillors for this area living or working in Queens Rd?. Where are they and what are their views on this issue?.

Yes drunkenduck I have lived in watford all my life and lived near or on Queens road for the last 15 years is that enough?? Yes I was incorrect about the half way house but there is still benefits scroungers accomodation in the area which isn't helpful. TRT.... the only people who may fear for business are those who sell alcohol at stupid prices, while I agree that councillors should be more involved in the area as I said before it is the people selling the alcohol, point the finger at them , 'a gradual slide into lawlessness' is an incredibly over dramatic view of the future....was everyone just as vocal where there was 4 pubs/bars in the area (and now only 1)

The gradual slide into lawlessness comment was a counter to the argument that places change over time. I didn't say that the area had changed, I said that it had become worse. My view of the future is that we should fight to make it better rather than accept it getting worse. And as for the decrease in the pubs... well, I was certainly vocal over the rebuilding of The Tantivy (mainly the number, size and quality of the flats and the loss of curtilage), but the councillors gave up fighting against the developers in the end.

srfc wrote:
wow the above report makes out that there are fights and policed called everyday and that just isn't the case. Shouldn't people be complaining about the half way houses that kick people out during the day that then go to the other shops in Queens Road and buy cheap alcohol,in fact isn't one of the people in the photo a person who runs one of the said shops.....mmmm if so i wonder why she is complaining??! And as for the comments above....E.Coli who on earth are you talking about??? and Mohandas are you commenting generally on the social state of the contry or specifically about Queens Road??! most of the people that buy from the shops don't actaully have jobs and live in the areas sheltered accomodation or in bedsits in Gladstone Road. So then who has kicked up a fuss about the amount of fast food shops in Queens Road, I think you wil find that these are the places that attract people after a night out and this is where you get 99% of your anti-social behaviour. However having had first had experience of Polish drinking and habits I agree that giving a Polish shop and alcohol license is probably a bad idea.

Err sorry for mentioning the pub had closed

There seems to be a distinct lack of interest on the part of the liberal councillors who represent the ward.

Next time, vote for someone with some balls (figuratively speaking). A liberal by definition lacks that key asset.

One day a rain is going to come.

MarsLander wrote:
There seems to be a distinct lack of interest on the part of the liberal councillors who represent the ward.

Next time, vote for someone with some balls (figuratively speaking). A liberal by definition lacks that key asset.

From the Latin liberalis "noble, gracious, munificent, generous"
literally "of freedom, pertaining to or befitting a free man," or from liber "free, unrestricted, unimpeded; unbridled, unchecked, licentious"

srfc wrote:
wow the above report makes out that there are fights and policed called everyday and that just isn't the case. Shouldn't people be complaining about the half way houses that kick people out during the day that then go to the other shops in Queens Road and buy cheap alcohol,in fact isn't one of the people in the photo a person who runs one of the said shops.....mmmm if so i wonder why she is complaining??! And as for the comments above....E.Coli who on earth are you talking about??? and Mohandas are you commenting generally on the social state of the contry or specifically about Queens Road??! most of the people that buy from the shops don't actaully have jobs and live in the areas sheltered accomodation or in bedsits in Gladstone Road. So then who has kicked up a fuss about the amount of fast food shops in Queens Road, I think you wil find that these are the places that attract people after a night out and this is where you get 99% of your anti-social behaviour. However having had first had experience of Polish drinking and habits I agree that giving a Polish shop and alcohol license is probably a bad idea.

Yes one of the people in the photo is a shop keeper. However, it's a franchise shop and therefore, certain conditions are imposed on the shop keeper. She is also a resident and has a right to her say as a resident. I have seen her extremely upset and distressed over all this on more than one occasion. Either she is one of the best actresses I've ever seen, or she is truly worried and scared and not just for her livelihood.

Local residents have objected to the latest plans for another fast food shop.

Thanks to those of you who posted positive/supportive comments. And those of you who live in the area, why not come along to the meeting on Thursday? 7pm at the Newton Price Centre and a free cup of tea/coffee thrown in!

Su Murray wrote:
Thanks to those of you who posted positive/supportive comments. And those of you who live in the area, why not come along to the meeting on Thursday? 7pm at the Newton Price Centre and a free cup of tea/coffee thrown in!

No booze? ;-)

MarsLander wrote:

Su Murray wrote:
Thanks to those of you who posted positive/supportive comments. And those of you who live in the area, why not come along to the meeting on Thursday? 7pm at the Newton Price Centre and a free cup of tea/coffee thrown in!

No booze? ;-)

*chuckle*

We could all visit one of the local pubs afterwards - purely to support local businesses you understand. Actually, in the interests of fair play, we'd have to visit them all. ;-0

srfc wrote:
wow the above report makes out that there are fights and policed called everyday and that just isn't the case. Shouldn't people be complaining about the half way houses that kick people out during the day that then go to the other shops in Queens Road and buy cheap alcohol,in fact isn't one of the people in the photo a person who runs one of the said shops.....mmmm if so i wonder why she is complaining??! And as for the comments above....E.Coli who on earth are you talking about??? and Mohandas are you commenting generally on the social state of the contry or specifically about Queens Road??! most of the people that buy from the shops don't actaully have jobs and live in the areas sheltered accomodation or in bedsits in Gladstone Road. So then who has kicked up a fuss about the amount of fast food shops in Queens Road, I think you wil find that these are the places that attract people after a night out and this is where you get 99% of your anti-social behaviour. However having had first had experience of Polish drinking and habits I agree that giving a Polish shop and alcohol license is probably a bad idea.

Dear srfc,
have you ever been at my shop - Great Poland?? - If no you must do this asap - then you'll see FROM WHICH PREMISES THE PROBLEM EXACTLY OCCURS at Queens Road!
Believe me - it's not about the boozy street, it's about the battle for customers.
Rgds,
Joanna - The Owner Of Great Poland

Su Murray wrote:

srfc wrote:
wow the above report makes out that there are fights and policed called everyday and that just isn't the case. Shouldn't people be complaining about the half way houses that kick people out during the day that then go to the other shops in Queens Road and buy cheap alcohol,in fact isn't one of the people in the photo a person who runs one of the said shops.....mmmm if so i wonder why she is complaining??! And as for the comments above....E.Coli who on earth are you talking about??? and Mohandas are you commenting generally on the social state of the contry or specifically about Queens Road??! most of the people that buy from the shops don't actaully have jobs and live in the areas sheltered accomodation or in bedsits in Gladstone Road. So then who has kicked up a fuss about the amount of fast food shops in Queens Road, I think you wil find that these are the places that attract people after a night out and this is where you get 99% of your anti-social behaviour. However having had first had experience of Polish drinking and habits I agree that giving a Polish shop and alcohol license is probably a bad idea.

Yes one of the people in the photo is a shop keeper. However, it's a franchise shop and therefore, certain conditions are imposed on the shop keeper. She is also a resident and has a right to her say as a resident. I have seen her extremely upset and distressed over all this on more than one occasion. Either she is one of the best actresses I've ever seen, or she is truly worried and scared and not just for her livelihood.

Local residents have objected to the latest plans for another fast food shop.

Dear Su,
yes you're right - She can be extremely upset and distressed even in a sec. But on the other hand can you imagine how we feel when another time we read at W.O. about the Great Poland how bad we are??? Have you ever been at our place, if not - pls come and look around. We had few other councillors visiting our shop and truly they loved it. I have to mention that almost every day since we started to run our business we've at least one "guest" from the "franchising shop" not to buy something - only for checking the prices and what kind of goods we sell and if it's not ex some whisky very cheap selling at "franchising shops". Desperate childish behaviour don't you think?
I'll say again - it's a battle about the customers between the businesses and i do not believe in truly intentions of that campaign.

Finally - i really regret i couldn't join the meeting last Thursday, i had no one to stay with my kids...

kind regards:
Joanna - Great Poland, 85 Queens Road

sunrise78 wrote:

Su Murray wrote:

srfc wrote:
wow the above report makes out that there are fights and policed called everyday and that just isn't the case. Shouldn't people be complaining about the half way houses that kick people out during the day that then go to the other shops in Queens Road and buy cheap alcohol,in fact isn't one of the people in the photo a person who runs one of the said shops.....mmmm if so i wonder why she is complaining??! And as for the comments above....E.Coli who on earth are you talking about??? and Mohandas are you commenting generally on the social state of the contry or specifically about Queens Road??! most of the people that buy from the shops don't actaully have jobs and live in the areas sheltered accomodation or in bedsits in Gladstone Road. So then who has kicked up a fuss about the amount of fast food shops in Queens Road, I think you wil find that these are the places that attract people after a night out and this is where you get 99% of your anti-social behaviour. However having had first had experience of Polish drinking and habits I agree that giving a Polish shop and alcohol license is probably a bad idea.

Yes one of the people in the photo is a shop keeper. However, it's a franchise shop and therefore, certain conditions are imposed on the shop keeper. She is also a resident and has a right to her say as a resident. I have seen her extremely upset and distressed over all this on more than one occasion. Either she is one of the best actresses I've ever seen, or she is truly worried and scared and not just for her livelihood.

Local residents have objected to the latest plans for another fast food shop.

Dear Su,
yes you're right - She can be extremely upset and distressed even in a sec. But on the other hand can you imagine how we feel when another time we read at W.O. about the Great Poland how bad we are??? Have you ever been at our place, if not - pls come and look around. We had few other councillors visiting our shop and truly they loved it. I have to mention that almost every day since we started to run our business we've at least one "guest" from the "franchising shop" not to buy something - only for checking the prices and what kind of goods we sell and if it's not ex some whisky very cheap selling at "franchising shops". Desperate childish behaviour don't you think?
I'll say again - it's a battle about the customers between the businesses and i do not believe in truly intentions of that campaign.

Finally - i really regret i couldn't join the meeting last Thursday, i had no one to stay with my kids...

kind regards:
Joanna - Great Poland, 85 Queens Road

just two more things:
1. - message to everyone - at our shop WE DO NOT SELL any single cans beer & cider, basicly we do not sell any beer at all! The only alcohol we currently sell is qualited polish vodka / spirits - much more expensive than this that you can buy in neighbourhood, nicely wrapped, NOT FOR DRINKING OUTSIDE THE PREMISES ON THE STREET!
So - who is doing the street's "bad job" then....?

2. question the the author of the article Mike Wright, Chief Reporter - why (another time) you use our business' name without any doubts and that's the only name you can find in the whole article??? i think i'll ask our lawyer how it's of the legal rights...

Rgds,
Joanna, Great Poland

sunrise78 wrote:

Su Murray wrote:

srfc wrote:
wow the above report makes out that there are fights and policed called everyday and that just isn't the case. Shouldn't people be complaining about the half way houses that kick people out during the day that then go to the other shops in Queens Road and buy cheap alcohol,in fact isn't one of the people in the photo a person who runs one of the said shops.....mmmm if so i wonder why she is complaining??! And as for the comments above....E.Coli who on earth are you talking about??? and Mohandas are you commenting generally on the social state of the contry or specifically about Queens Road??! most of the people that buy from the shops don't actaully have jobs and live in the areas sheltered accomodation or in bedsits in Gladstone Road. So then who has kicked up a fuss about the amount of fast food shops in Queens Road, I think you wil find that these are the places that attract people after a night out and this is where you get 99% of your anti-social behaviour. However having had first had experience of Polish drinking and habits I agree that giving a Polish shop and alcohol license is probably a bad idea.

Yes one of the people in the photo is a shop keeper. However, it's a franchise shop and therefore, certain conditions are imposed on the shop keeper. She is also a resident and has a right to her say as a resident. I have seen her extremely upset and distressed over all this on more than one occasion. Either she is one of the best actresses I've ever seen, or she is truly worried and scared and not just for her livelihood.

Local residents have objected to the latest plans for another fast food shop.

Dear Su,
yes you're right - She can be extremely upset and distressed even in a sec. But on the other hand can you imagine how we feel when another time we read at W.O. about the Great Poland how bad we are??? Have you ever been at our place, if not - pls come and look around. We had few other councillors visiting our shop and truly they loved it. I have to mention that almost every day since we started to run our business we've at least one "guest" from the "franchising shop" not to buy something - only for checking the prices and what kind of goods we sell and if it's not ex some whisky very cheap selling at "franchising shops". Desperate childish behaviour don't you think?
I'll say again - it's a battle about the customers between the businesses and i do not believe in truly intentions of that campaign.

Finally - i really regret i couldn't join the meeting last Thursday, i had no one to stay with my kids...

kind regards:
Joanna - Great Poland, 85 Queens Road

Hi Joanna,

Yes I have been in your shop. I found it clean and attractively laid out. Your staff were friendly and helpful. And the produce I bought was tasty - my family are now frequently badgering me for more. I only had one tiny, concern when I visited and I'm happy to pop in and share that with you. Actually, not so much a 'concern' as a thought about how your produce could be even more accessible to locals.

But then we never had any doubt about the idea of a Polish deli - in fact, we were excited by the idea.

The worry was only about yet more alcohol being available for purchase. And it was never a reflection or a judgement on you. From a business perspective, I can fully understand why you wanted an alcohol licence.

I'm sorry you couldn't make it to the meeting last Thursday because I would have really liked to hear your ideas. As someone who has chosen to invest in the area, I would have liked it if you could tell us what encouraged you to make that decision.

As to the 'childish desperate behaviour' you mention, I have no way of knowing. I don't actually stand on the corner watching all day. What I do know is, we all want to live in a happy, pleasant environment, and we all want the traders to prosper, along with the residents, in a safe environment.

Despite how it must seem to you, the concerns were never personal. The frustration for people in this area is, that it is actually a lovely community. You are now a member of this community. Let's work together to realise it's full potential.

I'll even offer to baby sit, once you know I'm safe - if it helps!

Best wishes,

Su