Campaign group invites residents to Fairtrade Fortnight (From Watford Observer)
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Watford Fairtrade Town Steering Group invites residents to Fairtrade Fortnight
2:40pm Wednesday 20th February 2013 in News
By Rebecca Perring, Reporter
Fairtrade campaigners in Watford are gearing up to kick off a fortnight of activities to promote the cause.
Watford Fairtrade Town Steering Group is inviting residents to a meeting on Monday, February 25 to mark the first day of Fairtrade Fortnight.
The meeting, Fairtrade and the Financial Crisis, hosts a variety of guest speakers including representatives from TWIN Trading and Zaytoun Olive Products, Palestine.
Fairtrade Fortnight starts on Monday and is a national event to raise awareness about the importance of paying farmers in developing countries a fair price for their goods.
Watford was declared a Fairtrade town in 2007.
The meeting will take place in Watford Borough Council Chamber between 6:30pm and 8pm.
For more details contact Brian Mee on 01923 234033.
Comments(21)
Wacko Jacko
says...
3:44pm Wed 20 Feb 13
MarsLander wrote:Why not?
Why is the council even having anything to do with this?
It's a great idea, but why is our council involved? This is a supplier and more so a consumer thing.
MarsLander
says...
3:56pm Wed 20 Feb 13
Wacko Jacko wrote:Why should it?
MarsLander wrote:Why not?
Why is the council even having anything to do with this?
It's a great idea, but why is our council involved? This is a supplier and more so a consumer thing.
Clearly it costs the council money to do it.
How does it justify this expense?
Mike Ribble
says...
4:37pm Wed 20 Feb 13
MarsLander
says...
5:01pm Wed 20 Feb 13
fair point.
Of course, it is quite acceptable to question council spending, no matter how many boxes have been ticked in the past to make it all legal and above board, I would hope you would agree.
When the council is run by one party, is there any point going to them over any matters? I do not hold any great faith in their ability to listen or take things onboard. The LibDem mafia are not known for listening to dissenting opinions.
Mike Ribble
says...
5:41pm Wed 20 Feb 13
For some time now the Lib Dems have held sway with the majority of voters. But that doesn't mean they are deaf to everyone else. But you have to accept they may not agree with you.
And you are right that questioning policies is acceptable. There is nothing stopping you from emailing the Mayor and asking her to justify the decision to support the fair trade town initiative and/or offering a contrary argument.
MarsLander
says...
6:03pm Wed 20 Feb 13
I might just do that but I wouldn't contact the Mayor, I have no faith in her abilities whatsoever.
Can anyone tell me what a fairtrade town is and how much it costs Watford council to be a fairtrade town annually?
Mike Ribble
says...
6:20pm Wed 20 Feb 13
MarsLander
says...
6:38pm Wed 20 Feb 13
garston tony
says...
12:12pm Thu 21 Feb 13
As to costing money, its going to be minimal at worst yet the impact could be significant to those at the source of the goods.
The fact that you have no interest in the matter just makes your complaint silly really, if you genuinly had a problem you would get involved. You don’t,you just want to have a go. Are you Roy Stockdill in disguise? I know what his version of fair trade would be, invade a country,subjugate its population and take whatever you want, leave and then wonder why they don’t necessarily like you!
MarsLander
says...
3:35pm Thu 21 Feb 13
I have no interest in Watford being a fairtrade town so why would I go to a meeting about it? I have better things to do.
I believe in fairtrade, I remember it starting and it is a good idea in principle. I just don't know why the council is involved at all. I buy some fairtrade goods at the shops and leave others. For me it must not be bad value.
After I posted the last comment I looked at the fairtrade website. There is so much info there who needs the council to give info out? I wouldn't waste a penny on that.
It does however force the council to serve fairtrade goods at meetings etc. Nice in principle but I suspect may cost significantly more than non-fairtrade goods. We are looking for value for money in Watford I hope. By all means use fairtrade if it offers good value for money, but don't spend our money wastefully chasing fairtrade dreams when the fairtraders may be ripping us off.
Those are my concerns.
I think you should apologise for those slanderous comments you made about Roy before he (or is it I?) sees them.
BTW, two of the worst excuses for wasting money and doing things inefficiently are "We have always done it this way", and yours, "We're not the only council doing this by a long stretch".
I'm trying to make Watford council more responsible. I'm afraid I will leave the other councils to their own devices.
"Minimal at worst" - pretty meaningless without figures Tony.
LSC
says...
7:57pm Thu 21 Feb 13
Under the normal system, the farmers get very little, and the shippers and retailers get a lot.
My idea of Fair Trade would be to even this out. Alas, this is not the case. YES, the farmer does get more money, and that is good. But so does the shipper for doing no extra work whatsoever and ditto the retailer.
A jar of Fair Trade coffee costs no more to ship or retail than ordinary coffee, but if is 15% more expensive then the shippers, retailers and tax man all get a proportional cut. The farmer is lucky to see 3% of that 15.
Unfair Trade in my book, on the farmers and the shoppers trying to do the right thing.
MarsLander
says...
8:25pm Thu 21 Feb 13
LSC wrote:Why doesn’t Fairtrade certify large coffee plantations?
I'm afraid I don't really trust Fair Trade anyway. I love the principal, but as ever the reality is different.
Under the normal system, the farmers get very little, and the shippers and retailers get a lot.
My idea of Fair Trade would be to even this out. Alas, this is not the case. YES, the farmer does get more money, and that is good. But so does the shipper for doing no extra work whatsoever and ditto the retailer.
A jar of Fair Trade coffee costs no more to ship or retail than ordinary coffee, but if is 15% more expensive then the shippers, retailers and tax man all get a proportional cut. The farmer is lucky to see 3% of that 15.
Unfair Trade in my book, on the farmers and the shoppers trying to do the right thing.
Around 70% of the world’s coffee farmers are small-scale growers, and they face particular disadvantages in the market place. Fairtrade’s mission is to make trade work for marginalised or disadvantaged producers, and therefore there is a global agreement that the system should offer champion purchase of sustainable coffee from organisations of small coffee farmers explicitly. Read our fairtrade_and_coffee
_plantations (22.25KB) (PDF) to find out more.
========
The fairtrade website admits that it skews the trade in products in favour of small producers and refuses to certify large producers. It also will not certify UK producers.
This scheme therefore is inherently unfair, it's not based on ethical standards alone, it also is anti big business and anti-UK producers.
I have now stopped choosing fairtrade products.
Thank you LSC for making me look into it a little further.
MarsLander
says...
8:26pm Thu 21 Feb 13
.org.uk/what_is_fair
trade/faqs.aspx
In case Wacko stumbles upon this page, it's from the Fairtrade website itself. Good enough Wacko?
It sounded good until I actually investigated further. I don't like unfairness.
garston tony
says...
10:33am Fri 22 Feb 13
My comments about Roy still stands, he is also someone who makes comments just to get a response not necessarily because he cares about the issues involved. Precisely the message you are sending out
You'er 'trying to make Watford Council more responsible' and you don’t do that by just moaning about every penny spent but finding out about what it is spent on so that you can actually judge for yuorself instead of making blanket statements.
garston tony
says...
10:34am Fri 22 Feb 13
garston tony
says...
10:36am Fri 22 Feb 13
They don’t deal with larger groups/farms etc because they already get a fair price.They only deal with small farmers because they don’t.
Ie. Pre fair trade, large farmer gets 10pence per banana, small farmer gets 3pence per banana from same buyer.
Fair trade comes in and large farmer still gets 10 pence per banana from his buyer, small farmer now sells to fair trade and also gets 10 pence per banana.
Where on earth is this unfair? How could you look at this principle and think it wrong?!?!
MarsLander
says...
11:23am Fri 22 Feb 13
the WO is my forum of choice.
I have no faith whatsoever in local democracy because while the LibDems run Watford council there is absolutely no point going to one of their meetings.
The LibDems can only speak, they can't listen. I was at a council meeting last year and saw how local people and their views were ignored. I say once again, I have better things to do with my time that sit at meetings with the LibDems. Also, there are so many issues, wold you expect me to go to every council meeting? A bit unrealistic, I think. Even Clarkie doesn't go to every meeting and he's a councillor.
As for you and your bananas, what are your sources Tony? Can you provide a link?
What about UK producers? Do you care about UK farmers as well?
I think it's about time we started looking after our own producers rather than disadvantaging them by supporting foreign producers in this way.
garston tony
says...
1:13pm Fri 22 Feb 13
You are totally missing the point about fair trade. It is not there to buy goods from people who already get a fair price for their goods but to buy goods from people who dont get a fair price. And its focus is on third world countries.
Of course I care about UK farmers but how many of them only have one set of clothing which is worn and tattered, how many of them go hungry and cant feed their kids? How many of them cant send their kids to school not just because they cant afford the cost of it but because they need them as labour on their small holding? UK farmers may moan about supermarkets pushing down prices etc. but that is nothing as compared to the practises going on in other countries and at least UK farmers have a voice that can be heard.
Plus on the whole we're not talking about goods produced in this country either, we're talking things that are only grown abroad.
I have seen all the evidence I need to thank you, I have spoken to farmers who are now on the fair trade scheme who are getting far more money then they were before. They can now afford to clothe themselves and their family, they can now afford to eat properly, if there is a bad harvest one year they have been able to set something aside to help tide them over, their kids can get an education and have far better prospects.
Seriously, this isnt a difficult concept to comprehend so why are you making it so?
LSC
says...
1:16pm Fri 22 Feb 13
I was simply pointing out it isn't quite what many of the public perceive it to be.
When I pay 50p extra for a fair trade orange in Tescos, it galls me that Mr Tesco pockets 15p of that extra price for no outlay to themselves whatsoever; no extra shipping, storage, shelf space or paperwork. All that would have to be done anyway with normal oranges.
It is a rip off and that is unfair on the people it is supposed to help, and unfair on the shoppers patting each other on the back for making the world a better place.
LSC
says...
1:21pm Fri 22 Feb 13
MarsLander says...
2:59pm Wed 20 Feb 13
It's a great idea, but why is our council involved? This is a supplier and more so a consumer thing.