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Angry scenes anticipated at BNP debut (From Watford Observer)
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Angry scenes anticipated at BNP debut
8:49am Tuesday 16th June 2009
Angry scenes are expected later this morning as Hertfordshire’s first British National Party (BNP) councillor attends her first meeting.
Deidre Gates, who won the South Oxhey division in this month’s local elections by just 27 votes, will attend a meeting of the full council at County Hall, Hertford, at 10.30am.
Anti fascist groups have said they will protest outside the venue against what they describe as a racist party.
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Your Say YourWatford
mintygit, South Oxhey says...
9:16am Tue 16 Jun 09
Is Deidre Gates a man then?!
Even more controversy over the South Oxhey councillor!
srfc, watford says...
10:27am Tue 16 Jun 09
Rob Ridley, Croxley Green says...
10:42am Tue 16 Jun 09
Roy Stockdill, says...
10:53am Tue 16 Jun 09
Has it not occurred to anyone that the rent-a-mob who comprise the Loony Left are just as fascist in their attitudes as the BNP, for in protesting against the election of Ms Gates they are, in effect, saying that those who voted for her had no right to do so and must be prevented from voting for the BNP again, by threats of violence if necessary. Is this not just as much a negation of democracy as that which they accuse the BNP of and a manifestation of bullying totalitarianism? Frankly, the two sides deserve one another and the vast majority of ordinary, decent people will have nothing to do with either if they have any sense.
jed 722, South Oxhey says...
10:58am Tue 16 Jun 09
Shame the communist run Uaf didn't field some candidates against the Bnp in the recent elections if they felt so strongly???
... perhaps they knew they would have been trounced!lol!
The Bnp got nearly one million votes in the Euro elections across the country ... so all their shouting and throwing eggs will get them zilch!
They better just get used to plenty more Bnp'rs gettin elected up and down the country ... times are a changing!LOL
rod 689, high wycombe says...
11:16am Tue 16 Jun 09
The Eye of Mordor, Watford says...
11:17am Tue 16 Jun 09
bishopofwatford, bishopofwatford says...
11:26am Tue 16 Jun 09
what are we to believe then ? do we live in a democracy ? or as seems to be the case do live in a "sanitised" democracy where only certain views not only must be heard but above all else must prevail?? the answer to this rather prickly problem must surely lie with the right to free speech within the letter of the law.
this person has been duly elected by those who could be bothered to vote and frankly has just as much right to be a councillor as any other . however what is important is the behaviour of this new councillor--does she attend regularily ,hold surgeries ,and respond to written queries within a reasonable time?
then we can judge...rember the good book says " judge not lest thee be judged"'
well i am off now with the new archdeaconess harvesting some nuts --i know that should have been done in may but hey its been busy
keep the faith
Garston Tony, Garston says...
11:30am Tue 16 Jun 09
crazyfrog, Rickmansworth says...
12:08pm Tue 16 Jun 09
u k pensioner, uk says...
12:33pm Tue 16 Jun 09
srfc wrote:Stop acting you shoe size and grow up! name calling has never stopped anyone in life so cut it out!
UK pensioner...i guess you voted for the scumbags then??!!
Rob Ridley, Croxley Green says...
12:45pm Tue 16 Jun 09
epiphany, dorking says...
1:40pm Tue 16 Jun 09
Emma Wraithes, says...
1:56pm Tue 16 Jun 09
Johnjones1959, Aylesbury says...
2:43pm Tue 16 Jun 09
u k pensioner, uk says...
2:50pm Tue 16 Jun 09
Emma Wraithes wrote:Because that is an apt description of UAF! and to be frank im somewhat perplexed as to why David Cameron has added his name to these bunch of thugs
uk pensioner I agree name calling never gets you anywhere - so why in the first comment did you call people 'rent a mob thugs' and 'unwashed hooligans'?
srfc, watford says...
3:42pm Tue 16 Jun 09
tjb2376, says...
4:16pm Tue 16 Jun 09
tjb2376, says...
4:32pm Tue 16 Jun 09
jed 722, South Oxhey says...
4:32pm Tue 16 Jun 09
They were strangers to our area and they never cleared up the many Uaf discarded leaflets screwed up and thrown onto the floor by disgruntled members of the public ... pretty much sums these drug taking dirty scruffy people for what they are!LOL
tjb2376, says...
4:34pm Tue 16 Jun 09
Garston Tony, Garston says...
4:53pm Tue 16 Jun 09
Garston Tony, Garston says...
4:56pm Tue 16 Jun 09
tjb2376, says...
4:59pm Tue 16 Jun 09
tjb2376, says...
5:03pm Tue 16 Jun 09
re: the language - yes...you're right. i should rise above it and not get wound up by obvious liars like mr jed 722 and his 'strong lager'-swilling fantasy stories.
MrTruthmaster, Herts says...
5:51pm Tue 16 Jun 09
Neil Skinner quoted "Angry screnes" as he has obviously seen recent attacks on the BNP just like this one
http://www.timesonli
ne.co.uk/multimedia/
archive/00571/griffi
n_car_571056a.jpg
Now, there are loads of these pics scattered all over the web, Weyman Bennett was a thug at school but nothing has been brought up about that!
OPEN YOUR EYES.. This country is slowly being poured down the PAn thanks to Blair and now Brown. Cameron, Farage etc are all exactly the same.
BNP don't want Racial hatred and thats a fact! This Country has been rebuilt by many a race and i thank them all very much,
Im half Indian and my father came here in 53 and even i can see whats going on. Its the illegal immigrants and bogus asylum seekers drip drying the country until there is nothing left £18 Billion pounds spent on immigration .. Look out your window what do we have left? Mr Bennett i urge you to think about what you doing, you are inciting Racial Hatred into pumping the lies down peoples throats and stirring up anger..
The BNP wont just give up. We can see what we have to lose, i just wish you did also..
Thank you
Mr T
tjb2376, says...
6:13pm Tue 16 Jun 09
Really?
"The British National Party stands for the preservation of the national and ethnic character of the British people and is wholly opposed to any form of racial integration between British and non-European peoples. It is therefore committed to stemming and reversing the tide of non-white immigration"
BNP constitution
tjb2376, says...
6:14pm Tue 16 Jun 09
"I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that 6 million Jews were gassed and cremated or turned into lamp shades. Orthodox opinion also once held that the earth is flat… I have reached the conclusion that the ‘extermination’ tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie and latter witch-hysteria."
Nick Griffin 1997
tjb2376, says...
6:16pm Tue 16 Jun 09
"At the National Front, Brons was a close ally of Richard Verrall, the author of the Holocaust-denial tract Did Six Million Really Die?, who was vice-chairman. In 1981, while Brons was chairman, the NF endorsed We are National Front, a pamphlet carrying an introduction from Verrall. It had photographs of Brons and Verrall as well as a picture of a gorilla and a black man stating: "These two creatures look the same, don't they?"
Don't try and kid anyone that the BNP aren't racist. Of course they are...
Wilkinson, Watford says...
6:35pm Tue 16 Jun 09
tjb2376 wrote:Well he has a point that 6 million figure has never been proved, and was very likely to be a lot less AND contain people such as political opponents, gypsies, homosexuals. More Russians died in WW2 than Jews, if the full quote is to be used was what Nick Griffin was getting at.
Really?! "I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that 6 million Jews were gassed and cremated or turned into lamp shades. Orthodox opinion also once held that the earth is flat… I have reached the conclusion that the ‘extermination’ tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie and latter witch-hysteria." Nick Griffin 1997
Can i ask why you were not at work today and found time to be hanging around trying to disrupt the political process?
little kitten, watford says...
6:37pm Tue 16 Jun 09
And don't forget the labour party are riddled with old communists turned toffs mandelson, reid , clarke , healey , hain the hooligan who dug up cricket pitches in the 70s spoiling the enjoyment of millions to get his point across
Let the rabble have their demo's as long as it remains civilised and let those democratically elected get on with their jobs
Wilkinson, Watford says...
6:40pm Tue 16 Jun 09
tjb2376 wrote:Whats wrong with wanting to preserve British national and ethnic identity? This is a very good thing and is certainly not racist.
"BNP don't want Racial hatred and thats a fact!" MrTruthmaster Really? "The British National Party stands for the preservation of the national and ethnic character of the British people and is wholly opposed to any form of racial integration between British and non-European peoples. It is therefore committed to stemming and reversing the tide of non-white immigration" BNP constitution
I think you far left communist thugs at UAF really need to take a look at yourselves and where things have gone wrong in your life. Your obsession with the BNP is nauseating and borders on the insane.
They are the fastest growing political party in the UK for a reason, perhaps you should look to your beloved Labour Party for the answers, and see how they, and Thatcher before them have destroyed this country. Nearly 1 million people voted for the BNP in the European elections, are you trying to tell me they are all facists?
rod 689, high wycombe says...
6:55pm Tue 16 Jun 09
tjb2376 wrote:As one of the protestors who was there today, we had to make ourselves heard........really ?
As one of the protestors who was there today, we had to make ourselves heard, and it is important that people realise exactly who the BNP are. However, in the grand scheme of things there isn't much to worry about. Trying to argue about ideology or policy with the BNP is completely futile, because none of them understand it anyway. Just check out new councillor Deidre struggling to say the word 'cohesion' in context on the BBC London News! Hilarious! The BNP are politically inept, and their so-called victory will have absolutely no effect on anything whatsover. They are impotent and useless. If you chucked a BNP member/supporter into a barrel of t*ts he'd come out sucking his thumb! Pathetic idiots - the lot of them!
...... shame there were only a dozen like minded losers then !
Syd Henley, Nottingham says...
8:20pm Tue 16 Jun 09
As that is exactly what the members of the UAF do, that final paragraph of the article should actually read - Fascist groups have said they will protest outside the venue ...
Due to their very childish behaviour and undemocratic dogma, the UAF should give serious consideration to changing their kiddy club name to - the United Association of Fascists.
MrTruthmaster, Herts says...
9:38pm Tue 16 Jun 09
http://www.timesonli
ne.co.uk/multimedia/
archive/00571/griffi
n_car_571056a.jpg
Also, nick was right, who knows whether it was 6 million 2 million or 20 million people that died in the holacaust?
Is this the same Ken Livingstone who has in the past made anti-semitic remarks, shared a platform with extremist Islamic preachers, criticising Sir Trevor Phillips?
and wasnt it Ken Livingston the Chairman of the UAF just a few years back that got suspended for a racial attack on a reporter?
How can anyone from the UAF say this country isnt being overtaken? we have Muslim MP's shalik malik(admit not every muslim is an extremist) whom coincidentally was the main abuser of expenses also admitting he wanted Britain as an islamic country? The teaching of 1000,s of kids that koraan says they should kill non believers "also known as the Kuffarr", jews, christians & gays should be killed?
Gay people say they are worried and intimidated by the BNP, th BNP would do nothing to them, Islam would kill them. Now i have nothing against gay people, and i certainly wouldn't want them all dead!
oh and BNP is open to all White North Europeans.. You cant base what Nick said 13 years ago.. We need someone tough with a backbone to run this country otherwise theyll just fall over like the rest have.
Unemployment, stabbings, muggings, burglary, all on the up.. what is CON & LAB going to do about it? You just sit back n watch it all happen.. Check some roughly estimated stats, Labour say ethnic minorite consist of about 10% of the population in GB but prisons consist of 40% thats weird isnt it! So am i racist to suggest Ethnic Minorities are 4 times more likely to commit a crime than Brits?
of the 28 stabbings in London last year on average 24 should be on non ethnic minority yea?
Well 28 of the 28 murders were ALL by ethnic minority..
shall we go on? Oh no were not allowed as it would be racist to suggest that! Not racist just realist there is a difference
Garston Tony, Garston says...
9:06am Wed 17 Jun 09
Should ythe BNP be a legal party? You could argue that all day long, what I find strange is that they currently are legal and yet people in certain professions are banned at pain of being sacked of being members of that party. THAT is not very democratic. If that is the situation we are in can I suggest all those that voted for the Labour party in the last general election should also be sacked? After all that party has made a bigger mess of this country then the BNP has or ever could.
A significant amount of people either because they truly believe in the BNP manifesto or as a protest vote did support them in elections. Many more I would imagien did not vote for them only because of their very extreme beliefs yet do agree in principal with their stance on immigration and europe. We live in a democratic country where we have the freedom to vote for who we want or not vote at all. If you chose not to vote then you are chosing to agree with the verdict of those that do, if you did vote then you have to accept the democratic rights of those that didnt and their choice to allow a situation where a so caleld racist party can be elected by those that did vote. Thats democracy it may not be perfect but it is right.
What we need is strong political leadership that is truly interested in what is best for this country and all of us in it and not interested in just doing things to win votes, keep power or line their pockets. Dare I say it but Thatcher was the last decent PM this country had, as controversial as she was and is at least she did what she thought was right and never bowed down to Europe or anyone else. Oh just in case your wondering I vote Lib Dem more often than not
Garston Tony, Garston says...
9:13am Wed 17 Jun 09
tjb2376, says...
10:38am Wed 17 Jun 09
ient, knuckle-dragging neanderthals that both represent and support the BNP will just mess it up and make themselves look really stupid, so lets just laugh ourselves silly watching them! Great entertainment...
peregrine, uk says...
11:05am Wed 17 Jun 09
tjb2376 wrote:You don't make any sense you silly arse -- you say the demonstrating needs to continue? yet only 12 demonstrators turned up? and if they are insignifcant,why the need to demonstrate? make your mind up fool as you are making yourself look very silly
The campaigning and demonstrating against the BNP needs to continue to remind people how truly abhorrent these people and their misguided views are. But don't worry, they are completely and utterly insignificant in the grand scheme of things, and of no real threat politically. Deidre will make an idiot of herself in her new council seat, as BNP candidates always do, and they'll fail in the European Parliament too. The intellectually-defic ient, knuckle-dragging neanderthals that both represent and support the BNP will just mess it up and make themselves look really stupid, so lets just laugh ourselves silly watching them! Great entertainment...
tjb2376, says...
11:27am Wed 17 Jun 09
KevMaskill, The Meriden Watford says...
11:33am Wed 17 Jun 09
Both of them then got British citizenship by Naturalisation, the older woman would have probably got it any way.
Any chance of either getting deported back to country of origin for the lies.
I'm in 2 minds whether to do anything with the info.
Anyone have any idea if the UKBorder dept would do anything if i reported this fraud?
Syd Henley, Nottingham says...
12:02pm Wed 17 Jun 09
"Cant believe that there are people out there who seriously doubt the reality of the holocaust, any body who does is a first class donught".
It is highly unlikely that anyone including Mr. Griffin doubts the reality of the holocaust. Historical FACTS such as the presence of the camps, the gas chambers, crematoria, mass graves, etc., cannot be denied. But what is in serious doubt, by most intelligent, thinking people, are the actual numbers of Jews killed. Even Jewish scholars and academics cannot agree on the exact figures.
All contemporary records of the period including official and unofficial (guards and inmates personal diaries etc.) concentration camp records (and we should remember that the Germans were and still are sticklers for accurate record keeping) indicate that as well as Jews, the deaths also included, non-Jewish Poles, Czechs, Romanian's, Russians & many other nationalities. They also include German criminals and German political prisoners, European Gypsies and even some allied prisoners of war.
Yes, vast numbers of human beings were killed but no one can or ever will know the exact numbers of each individual ethnic and religious group that died.
My own guess (it can be no other than a guess) would be that as there were far more none Jewish people than Jewish people in Europe at that time, it would be common sense to accept that far more none Jewish people than Jewish people died in the camps.
Anyone who accepts ANY of the figures being bandied around, as being a proven FACT, is a first class doughnut or worse, a complete idiot.
tjb2376, says...
1:59pm Wed 17 Jun 09
Syd Henley
Errr, yes...he does.
"I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that 6 million Jews were gassed and cremated or turned into lamp shades. Orthodox opinion also once held that the earth is flat… I have reached the conclusion that the ‘extermination’ tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie and latter witch-hysteria."
Nick Griffin 1997
jed 722, South Oxhey says...
2:36pm Wed 17 Jun 09
tjb2376 wrote:I suggest you are a liar and not from our area and you was not even there yesterday because if you had been ... you would have been ashamed by the turn out 13???... and you would have seen your organiser drinking stella lager and smoking joints with his fellow comrades...??? nice try sunshine ... now clear off and leave the good people of South Oxhey to get back to supporting what ever political party they choose without your type coming here!LOL
As one of the protestors who was there today, we had to make ourselves heard, and it is important that people realise exactly who the BNP are. However, in the grand scheme of things there isn't much to worry about. Trying to argue about ideology or policy with the BNP is completely futile, because none of them understand it anyway. Just check out new councillor Deidre struggling to say the word 'cohesion' in context on the BBC London News! Hilarious! The BNP are politically inept, and their so-called victory will have absolutely no effect on anything whatsover. They are impotent and useless. If you chucked a BNP member/supporter into a barrel of t*ts he'd come out sucking his thumb! Pathetic idiots - the lot of them!
MrTruthmaster, Herts says...
3:02pm Wed 17 Jun 09
Media:
You know how the media works, UAF use it enough, you think i believe anything i read in the papers especially from 13 years ago, There is a clip on Youtube of Nick just last week on SKY saying of course he believes in the holacaust how couldn't anyone?
Also stating the BNP dont plan on sending back everyone non white, its something you people made up! That is rubbish.. How could this country possibly survive? It would mean me goign back too, but look into it as i did and youll see the rumours are rubbish.
As for Labour, i believe 2 of their MP's have just been sent down for Paedophilia and the other for a physical and verbal racist attack on a traffic warden. Let alone all the CON Mp's
You can get all the media you want, you will look fools when this country gets so far in the pit you will only have yourself to blame. When theft and burglary and car crime and muggings in Hertford all go up which they are because the spill over from Hoddesdon & Harlow!This is a democratic society, people arent allowed to have a view and vote because of people like you that intimidating others with your threatening members kicking and throwing rocks at innocent people. people still vote but are scared to talk about it in fear people are thinking they are racist and thugs, My 76 year old Indian granfather, Paid more taxes than you since 1953 is he a racist and a thug? He voted BNP regardless of what you think. Your either Racist yourself, ignorant, have plenty of money or have your fingers in the blind mans coin cup.
Do what ever you like, i dont want my County & Country being pulled down the Plug hole after seeing it happen in other places.
tjb2376, says...
3:27pm Wed 17 Jun 09
There were more than 13 people there. You can see that clearly on the TV footage. Secondly, it made the national TV news, which is good enough for us. It might not have been the best attended demo ever, but at least people can see that UAF are standing up against the BNP and their horrific views wherever they show their faces. That's all that was required, and we acheived that. Thanks for your interest in UAF.
tjb2376, says...
4:33pm Wed 17 Jun 09
your rambling, stream-of-consciousn
ess diatribe is just too all over the place to make any sense of. What's your overall point, in concise language?
da ron ron, haverford west says...
7:55pm Wed 17 Jun 09
tjb2376 wrote:
MrTruthmaster, your rambling, stream-of-consciousn ess diatribe is just too all over the place to make any sense of. What's your overall point, in concise language?
Plop!!!!
Garston Tony, Garston says...
10:00am Thu 18 Jun 09
Anybody who disputes that is either ignorant gullible gimp or fudging history. Is it right that some in a political party like the bnp are in this category. No. What is right is that people have a right to vote for them if they so wish and that those that oppose them have an equal right to vote for someone else. The BNP getting some seats I hope makes those that could not be bothered to vote realise how important it is to do so
tjb2376, says...
1:08pm Thu 18 Jun 09
---
There are aspects of multiculturalism that just haven't worked. Faith schools? No. But that applies to Church of England and Catholic too, not just Islam. How can you turn to a Muslim and say its OK to have Catholic and CofE schools over here but not Islamic schools? Get rid of them all. Religion doesn’t belong in school. It’s a personal thing, for the home and the church. It should not be part of an educational curriculum. The example of some Jewish communities having their own court system? No. Wrong. We live in one country, we should all abide by the same laws and rules and be judged by the same courts. Segregation - creating phenomenon like 'Banglatown' in London, or the heavily concentrated Jewish communities in North London? Maybe not describable as ‘wrong’, but not sensible – ill-advised. It breeds mistrust and resentment, and does not aid assimilation or integration.
On the subject of integration, anyone who comes to this country should try their best, with as much assistance as is needed, to assimilate into the culture of this land. They should be encouraged and helped to learn English and to share in the traditions of this country. They should be prepared to commit to making a positive contribution to society. That said, there are legions of British people (white, indigenous – whatever) who need to make exactly the same commitment, and I am sorry to say that often it is just these people who do not positively contribute to society who are the one’s complaining about immigrants in the first place. Encouraging assimilation and integration should all be part of us developing a shared national identity, which means that just as immigrants need to adhere to the cultural values of the culture they are joining, the existing culture need to accept that there will be changes coming the other way as well, to enable the culture to exist and evolve. All together, no matter what race.
It is not about having an old, 'Little-England' set of cultural values that we force everyone to adhere to or they get, as the BNP would put it, 'sent back'. That won't work. It needs to be a an organic process. Immigrants accept that they should learn English and try to integrate into our culture and society. We, as the dominant culture in this particular part of the world, accept and integrate people and accept that their will be changes to our own culture as a result of immigration. That is a good thing, as long it’s the positive changes that are being adopted, and the negative discarded. Now this brings up a contentious point. Who decides what is positive or negative? What is right or wrong? The culture as a whole do. If a set of immigrants decided that female genital mutilation was an important part of their traditional life and wanted to do it here, would they be allowed to? No, because the majority would consider it abhorrent. However, a group of immigrants wish to celebrate a traditional festival, then yes, of course there is no problem with that!
tjb2376, says...
1:09pm Thu 18 Jun 09
There is, however everything wrong with the nationalistic, authoritarian method of dealing with culture and immigration by the BNP. They could not be more wrong. They want to stamp their values on immigrants, and throw them out if they refuse to abide by them. They are happy to use force and violence to achieve this aim. They are intolerant of the beliefs of other, and will not accept changes to British society and culture that may be brought by the migration of people from other countries to this land. They proclaim themselves to be democratic, but are a fascist, authoritarian party - they are not interest in democracy. If they ever came to power, it would be 'their way, or the highway'. The BNP live off people's fears and exploit them. They are a fascist, racist, authoritarian, unnecessarily nationalistic group of people whose method of achieving their aims should, in a sensible world, render them unfit to run a political party.
It’s the shared future we should be aiming for, not a resurgence of white patriotism, nationalism and an almost imperial/colonial mindset. That’s not progress – that’s looking backwards.
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u k pensioner, uk says...
9:07am Tue 16 Jun 09