Croxley Rail Link plan approved by Government

Croxley Rail Link plan approved by Government

The proposed viaduct

Watford Hospital Station

Ascot Road Station

First published in News by

Work on a £120m rail project that will change the face of Watford and Croxley Green has been approved by the Government.

An official announcement that the long-running Croxley Rail Link project has been approved is due to take place tomorrow, the Watford Observer understands.

The new link will connect Croxley Station on the Metropolitan Line with currently disused track between Croxley Green and Watford High Street overground station.

A colossal rail bridge will run from Baldwins Lane in Croxley Green, past the Harvester restaurant and over the dual carriageway.

The new railway will then run along Watford Road, the Grand Union canal, and through west Watford, where two new stations will be built in Ascot Road and Vicarage Road.

Both MP for Watford Richard Harrington and the town's mayor Dorothy Thornhill, who have lobbied heavily for the project to go ahead, welcomed the news.

Mr Harrington “I am delighted that this Government has taken this decision and invested in the future of Watford.

“This development will be crucial in regenerating Watford and bringing much-needed investment in the town.

“Over the last few weeks I have spoken to the Transport Secretary and the Chancellor to push for Government support as I believe it will be a pivotal boost for Watford and the start of an exciting new chapter for the town.”

Mayor Dorothy Thornhill added: “I have a huge grin on my face. This is something I have wanted for the town for many years. I can't pretend that I am not proud that it is my government that has granted it.”

Speaking before the announcement, Mr Harrington described the project as “a major urban regeneration scheme for the poorest parts of Watford”.

A three dimensional video shows the scale of new route, which is hoped to be finished by 2016, as it winds its way from Croxley Green, along the railway bridge and into Watford.

Comments (47)

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5:57pm Tue 13 Dec 11

shalvey says...

BRILLIANT NEWS!
LET'S GET ON WITH IT ASAP!
BRILLIANT NEWS! LET'S GET ON WITH IT ASAP! shalvey
  • Score: 0

6:26pm Tue 13 Dec 11

TRT says...

Well, let's just see how it pans out now. These things have a habit of mutating.
Well, let's just see how it pans out now. These things have a habit of mutating. TRT
  • Score: 0

6:27pm Tue 13 Dec 11

AlbansWoodBear says...

Knock me down with a feather - still feel that it'll have a lot more hurdles to cross before it is actually completed.... if it actually gets completed that is - on balance the Croxley Rail link is a good thing
Knock me down with a feather - still feel that it'll have a lot more hurdles to cross before it is actually completed.... if it actually gets completed that is - on balance the Croxley Rail link is a good thing AlbansWoodBear
  • Score: 0

7:10pm Tue 13 Dec 11

CroxleyTandoori says...

GET IN!!! if anyone moans about this they are clearly retarded
GET IN!!! if anyone moans about this they are clearly retarded CroxleyTandoori
  • Score: 0

7:12pm Tue 13 Dec 11

Nigel Spate says...

Great news. This scheme has been mooted for many years and at long last it is going to happen.
Great news. This scheme has been mooted for many years and at long last it is going to happen. Nigel Spate
  • Score: 0

8:13pm Tue 13 Dec 11

John Howard Norfolk says...

I wish my Aunt Doris Lacey who worked at the old Croxley Station was still alive to hear this wonderful news. She told me many stories of how popular her station was in the 1940's.
The residents of West Watford should be well pleased with this exciting project.
I wish my Aunt Doris Lacey who worked at the old Croxley Station was still alive to hear this wonderful news. She told me many stories of how popular her station was in the 1940's. The residents of West Watford should be well pleased with this exciting project. John Howard Norfolk
  • Score: 0

8:36pm Tue 13 Dec 11

E. Phellova says...

Fantastic news for West Watford, not so for house prices in Cassiobury.
Fantastic news for West Watford, not so for house prices in Cassiobury. E. Phellova
  • Score: 0

9:03pm Tue 13 Dec 11

Reg Edit says...

What's happening to the existing Watford station? Is that closing now?
What's happening to the existing Watford station? Is that closing now? Reg Edit
  • Score: 0

9:04pm Tue 13 Dec 11

TRT says...

Or anyone whose house backs onto the line.
Or anyone whose house backs onto the line. TRT
  • Score: 0

10:11pm Tue 13 Dec 11

gusgreen says...

TRT wrote:
Or anyone whose house backs onto the line.
I do and have been waiting for this line for over 30 years great news and about time too!
[quote][p][bold]TRT[/bold] wrote: Or anyone whose house backs onto the line.[/p][/quote]I do and have been waiting for this line for over 30 years great news and about time too! gusgreen
  • Score: 0

10:24pm Tue 13 Dec 11

TRT says...

The Met station is due to close to passengers in 2016 on completion of the works. The station will remain as a stabling yard, so there's always the possibility that in future the passenger service could be saved. Of course, Watford Junction falls into its own pricing zone, so just how the fares will look remains to be seen.
The Met station is due to close to passengers in 2016 on completion of the works. The station will remain as a stabling yard, so there's always the possibility that in future the passenger service could be saved. Of course, Watford Junction falls into its own pricing zone, so just how the fares will look remains to be seen. TRT
  • Score: 0

10:36pm Tue 13 Dec 11

drunkenduck says...

Don't think it's going to be value for money for many people who will use it. Just guessing people will still use the buses, cars etc to travel the using this new route.
Don't think it's going to be value for money for many people who will use it. Just guessing people will still use the buses, cars etc to travel the using this new route. drunkenduck
  • Score: 0

10:47pm Tue 13 Dec 11

TRT says...

Just looked it up. If they apply the same pricing policy as current, £2.70 cash, £1.50 oyster, from anywhere from Croxley onwards up to the junction.
Just looked it up. If they apply the same pricing policy as current, £2.70 cash, £1.50 oyster, from anywhere from Croxley onwards up to the junction. TRT
  • Score: 0

11:05pm Tue 13 Dec 11

hollywood101 says...

surely this will also have a positive impact on attendances at wfc ?
surely this will also have a positive impact on attendances at wfc ? hollywood101
  • Score: 0

8:04am Wed 14 Dec 11

Robjeeva says...

Fantastic News!
Fantastic News! Robjeeva
  • Score: 0

9:09am Wed 14 Dec 11

WFTTWTFR says...

There's a lot of HCC money going into this, so out of interest, has anybody got any thoughts on the following:

Will this line actually get significantly more traffic than the Croxley Green branch that was closed due to lack of use?

Why are new stations being built virtually adjacent to the disused (but in situ) Croxley Green, Watford West, and Watford Stadium stations?
There's a lot of HCC money going into this, so out of interest, has anybody got any thoughts on the following: Will this line actually get significantly more traffic than the Croxley Green branch that was closed due to lack of use? Why are new stations being built virtually adjacent to the disused (but in situ) Croxley Green, Watford West, and Watford Stadium stations? WFTTWTFR
  • Score: 0

9:35am Wed 14 Dec 11

Mike Watford says...

Fantastic news for Watford and south west Hertfordshire.
In the long term this scheme will bring hundreds of millions of pounds of economic benefits to the area, and provides more people, with better transport links.
Fantastic news for Watford and south west Hertfordshire. In the long term this scheme will bring hundreds of millions of pounds of economic benefits to the area, and provides more people, with better transport links. Mike Watford
  • Score: 0

9:40am Wed 14 Dec 11

The Rover says...

WFTTWTFR wrote:
There's a lot of HCC money going into this, so out of interest, has anybody got any thoughts on the following:

Will this line actually get significantly more traffic than the Croxley Green branch that was closed due to lack of use?

Why are new stations being built virtually adjacent to the disused (but in situ) Croxley Green, Watford West, and Watford Stadium stations?
There will definately be more usage than the Croxley Green Branch line had. This is not a branch line from Watford to Croxley Green. This is an extension to the Met line so you can get from Watford to Central London.
[quote][p][bold]WFTTWTFR[/bold] wrote: There's a lot of HCC money going into this, so out of interest, has anybody got any thoughts on the following: Will this line actually get significantly more traffic than the Croxley Green branch that was closed due to lack of use? Why are new stations being built virtually adjacent to the disused (but in situ) Croxley Green, Watford West, and Watford Stadium stations?[/p][/quote]There will definately be more usage than the Croxley Green Branch line had. This is not a branch line from Watford to Croxley Green. This is an extension to the Met line so you can get from Watford to Central London. The Rover
  • Score: 0

9:42am Wed 14 Dec 11

The Rover says...

hollywood101 wrote:
surely this will also have a positive impact on attendances at wfc ?
I dont think so. In fact, it may have the opposite affect making it easier to get to the big London clubs from Watford.
[quote][p][bold]hollywood101[/bold] wrote: surely this will also have a positive impact on attendances at wfc ?[/p][/quote]I dont think so. In fact, it may have the opposite affect making it easier to get to the big London clubs from Watford. The Rover
  • Score: 0

9:59am Wed 14 Dec 11

TRT says...

@WFTTWTFR

An identified issue with the old Croxley line was the lack of a through route. Terminal lines are notoriously unprofitable, but the "Beeching Effect" is now well known about, so closing dead-end lines is no longer done with the reckless abandon it once was. (That is to say that by cutting off unprofitable capillaries that feed passengers into the arterial routes, you can as a consequence turn an arterial route from profitable to unprofitable).

Croxley Green station was severed from the rest of the line when the new dual carriageway to the Business Park was built. To reinstate that bridge as well as a viaduct would cost more and make the alignment more damaging (the Harvester would be in the way, as well as several people's houses). Also Croxley Green station itself is little more than scaffolding and planks and would never meet modern accessibility and building standards. Possibly a footbridge over the dual carriageway could come in the future in order to reach the island Ascot Road station, but that is not within this project scope.
Watford West's ticket office was demolished in the 1990s and the land sold for housing. Also, the gradient of the line at that point is outside the requirements of modern practise - it's to do with uphill and downhill slopes, trains coasting in safely and getting a boost from gravity when setting off again. Plus, they wish to use part of the line-side to house a booster substation. Personally, I think that they should fix the gradients and re-use Watford West, due to its more central location with respect to the housing concentration in that area.
Watford Stadium halt is too close to Watford West for trains to efficiently operate. Also, the station is like Croxley Green in that it is mainly scaffold and planks, though it has fewer accessibility issues due to the ramp down onto the Cardiff Road footpath.
A better location for a stadium and hospital station would be on Cardiff Road at the former junction of the CRL and Ebury Way, as it is within the Watford Health Campus footprint. And reinstating the line and bridge over Wiggenhall Road to enable a route to Bushey would be a bonus, but the cost-benefit of such works has not been proven.
As for the proposed General Hospital station (what an awful name! Vicarage Road or Scammell Way would be much better), I can see Harwoods fields, the allotments and the land between Rose Gardens, Willow Lane and Cardiff Road being sold off to housing developers in the next 10 to 20 years in order to shore up the council coffers again.
@WFTTWTFR An identified issue with the old Croxley line was the lack of a through route. Terminal lines are notoriously unprofitable, but the "Beeching Effect" is now well known about, so closing dead-end lines is no longer done with the reckless abandon it once was. (That is to say that by cutting off unprofitable capillaries that feed passengers into the arterial routes, you can as a consequence turn an arterial route from profitable to unprofitable). Croxley Green station was severed from the rest of the line when the new dual carriageway to the Business Park was built. To reinstate that bridge as well as a viaduct would cost more and make the alignment more damaging (the Harvester would be in the way, as well as several people's houses). Also Croxley Green station itself is little more than scaffolding and planks and would never meet modern accessibility and building standards. Possibly a footbridge over the dual carriageway could come in the future in order to reach the island Ascot Road station, but that is not within this project scope. Watford West's ticket office was demolished in the 1990s and the land sold for housing. Also, the gradient of the line at that point is outside the requirements of modern practise - it's to do with uphill and downhill slopes, trains coasting in safely and getting a boost from gravity when setting off again. Plus, they wish to use part of the line-side to house a booster substation. Personally, I think that they should fix the gradients and re-use Watford West, due to its more central location with respect to the housing concentration in that area. Watford Stadium halt is too close to Watford West for trains to efficiently operate. Also, the station is like Croxley Green in that it is mainly scaffold and planks, though it has fewer accessibility issues due to the ramp down onto the Cardiff Road footpath. A better location for a stadium and hospital station would be on Cardiff Road at the former junction of the CRL and Ebury Way, as it is within the Watford Health Campus footprint. And reinstating the line and bridge over Wiggenhall Road to enable a route to Bushey would be a bonus, but the cost-benefit of such works has not been proven. As for the proposed General Hospital station (what an awful name! Vicarage Road or Scammell Way would be much better), I can see Harwoods fields, the allotments and the land between Rose Gardens, Willow Lane and Cardiff Road being sold off to housing developers in the next 10 to 20 years in order to shore up the council coffers again. TRT
  • Score: 0

10:02am Wed 14 Dec 11

TRT says...

@ The Rover.

"This is an extension to the Met line so you can get from Watford to Central London."

Well, you can already do that by three routes as it is; the Metropolitan Line, London Midland and London Overground!
@ The Rover. "This is an extension to the Met line so you can get from Watford to Central London." Well, you can already do that by three routes as it is; the Metropolitan Line, London Midland and London Overground! TRT
  • Score: 0

10:20am Wed 14 Dec 11

WFTTWTFR says...

Thanks for the info, TRT, I'm not that familiar with the details of the area and that was very comprehensive.
Thanks for the info, TRT, I'm not that familiar with the details of the area and that was very comprehensive. WFTTWTFR
  • Score: 0

10:21am Wed 14 Dec 11

Andrew1963 says...

WFTTWTFR wrote:
There's a lot of HCC money going into this, so out of interest, has anybody got any thoughts on the following: Will this line actually get significantly more traffic than the Croxley Green branch that was closed due to lack of use? Why are new stations being built virtually adjacent to the disused (but in situ) Croxley Green, Watford West, and Watford Stadium stations?
The principle benefits are to boost economic growth in Watford. Watford council will be able to sell the post office sorting site which it owns and is now vacant for high density offices that will generate local jobs. The link to central London is not in itself the benefit, but for Croxley residents, they can get into Watford Town Centre and Clarendon Road employment areas, and there will be now direct links from those areas to Northwood/Ruislip. There is also a prospect in future of running services to Watford Junction via Amersham and Aylesbury. All in all good news and well worth the extra government borrowing. The new locations of the stations are primarily led by the factor that Watford West does not serve the hospital/Health Campus redevelopment site or Watford stadium as well as a new station on Vicarage Road. Ascot Road station increases the value of the Watford Council owned business park and offers the opportunity to have a park and ride offer to reduce traffic on Rickmansworth Road. Key issues now is tyo reinstate the improvements to Watford High Street, with 20 trains an hour i think that the station needs a lift and far better pedestrian and bus service linkages. For example reconfigure the area outside the station as a bus station for Harlequin- Lower High street and better Pedestrian routes to Harlequin and Tesco.
[quote][p][bold]WFTTWTFR[/bold] wrote: There's a lot of HCC money going into this, so out of interest, has anybody got any thoughts on the following: Will this line actually get significantly more traffic than the Croxley Green branch that was closed due to lack of use? Why are new stations being built virtually adjacent to the disused (but in situ) Croxley Green, Watford West, and Watford Stadium stations?[/p][/quote]The principle benefits are to boost economic growth in Watford. Watford council will be able to sell the post office sorting site which it owns and is now vacant for high density offices that will generate local jobs. The link to central London is not in itself the benefit, but for Croxley residents, they can get into Watford Town Centre and Clarendon Road employment areas, and there will be now direct links from those areas to Northwood/Ruislip. There is also a prospect in future of running services to Watford Junction via Amersham and Aylesbury. All in all good news and well worth the extra government borrowing. The new locations of the stations are primarily led by the factor that Watford West does not serve the hospital/Health Campus redevelopment site or Watford stadium as well as a new station on Vicarage Road. Ascot Road station increases the value of the Watford Council owned business park and offers the opportunity to have a park and ride offer to reduce traffic on Rickmansworth Road. Key issues now is tyo reinstate the improvements to Watford High Street, with 20 trains an hour i think that the station needs a lift and far better pedestrian and bus service linkages. For example reconfigure the area outside the station as a bus station for Harlequin- Lower High street and better Pedestrian routes to Harlequin and Tesco. Andrew1963
  • Score: 0

10:31am Wed 14 Dec 11

TRT says...

Thank you, Andrew.

The LOROL take-over of the old DC line stations has had a dramatic effect on their appearance and operation. There are definitely improvements that can be made to High Street station and surrounding area, and the CRL adds a lot to the value of doing that.
Thank you, Andrew. The LOROL take-over of the old DC line stations has had a dramatic effect on their appearance and operation. There are definitely improvements that can be made to High Street station and surrounding area, and the CRL adds a lot to the value of doing that. TRT
  • Score: 0

12:05pm Wed 14 Dec 11

hawkhorn says...

Great news for Byewaters residents, looks like house prices will be going up!! Shame about Cassiobury residents, although most of them are rolling in it anyway!
Great news for Byewaters residents, looks like house prices will be going up!! Shame about Cassiobury residents, although most of them are rolling in it anyway! hawkhorn
  • Score: 0

12:19pm Wed 14 Dec 11

TRT says...

Of course one possible side effect is that the "rolling in it" Cassiobury residents, who demonstrably have a much higher car ownership, will have cause to use their vehicles instead of catching the Met.
Of course one possible side effect is that the "rolling in it" Cassiobury residents, who demonstrably have a much higher car ownership, will have cause to use their vehicles instead of catching the Met. TRT
  • Score: 0

12:31pm Wed 14 Dec 11

The Rover says...

TRT wrote:
Of course one possible side effect is that the "rolling in it" Cassiobury residents, who demonstrably have a much higher car ownership, will have cause to use their vehicles instead of catching the Met.
or get their chauffeurs to drive them to the new station :-)
[quote][p][bold]TRT[/bold] wrote: Of course one possible side effect is that the "rolling in it" Cassiobury residents, who demonstrably have a much higher car ownership, will have cause to use their vehicles instead of catching the Met.[/p][/quote]or get their chauffeurs to drive them to the new station :-) The Rover
  • Score: 0

1:34pm Wed 14 Dec 11

Andrew1963 says...

Or to discover that residents parking schemes mean they will not be able to park near to the new stations or Watford Junction!
Or to discover that residents parking schemes mean they will not be able to park near to the new stations or Watford Junction! Andrew1963
  • Score: 0

6:49pm Wed 14 Dec 11

lillylurcher says...

I think the whole scheme is a serious waste of money. Nobody uses the trains we have! Also what about those affected by the additional trains behind their victorian houses. According to the plans there is no assistance with sound proofing or supporting the foundations of these old properties. HCC should have thought about how they spend their money a little harder than this. They have cut many jobs and reduced the income of thousands of staff because they have no money! They have but just choose to spend it on what may be the largest white elephant Hertfordshire has ever seen and all funded by the tax payer. While WBC cut a wedge between Croxley Green and Watford with their viaduct and enhance the posh areas of Cassiobury and Nascott Wood and force the areas around Whippendell Road into an industrialised zone.
I think the whole scheme is a serious waste of money. Nobody uses the trains we have! Also what about those affected by the additional trains behind their victorian houses. According to the plans there is no assistance with sound proofing or supporting the foundations of these old properties. HCC should have thought about how they spend their money a little harder than this. They have cut many jobs and reduced the income of thousands of staff because they have no money! They have but just choose to spend it on what may be the largest white elephant Hertfordshire has ever seen and all funded by the tax payer. While WBC cut a wedge between Croxley Green and Watford with their viaduct and enhance the posh areas of Cassiobury and Nascott Wood and force the areas around Whippendell Road into an industrialised zone. lillylurcher
  • Score: 0

7:17pm Wed 14 Dec 11

hawkhorn says...

I think this is great news for Croxley, Watford and Cassiobury, all the negative posts are nothing but poppycock! Why can't we all be a little more positive about this project, I for one am.
I think this is great news for Croxley, Watford and Cassiobury, all the negative posts are nothing but poppycock! Why can't we all be a little more positive about this project, I for one am. hawkhorn
  • Score: 0

9:23pm Wed 14 Dec 11

TRT says...

Because people have genuine concerns about their environment. Dismissing their worries as poppycock and branding them as retarded is, frankly, ignorant. It remains to be seen what will happen with this project; it may take a hundred years before some things become evident. On the whole I think it's a good scheme but there are points for concern, such as the loss of the Met, the excessive noise and vibration of 20 trains an hour as close as ten feet from some houses (eg Ottoman Terrace, Orphenage Road), a huge viaduct across two bridges area, the positioning of the new stations etc.
There are bound to be benefits too; access to the business park, an alternative to buses improved east west links in hertfordshire etc. Let's just see. Though having Boris claiming Watford as a travel hub for his London is a bit galling.
Because people have genuine concerns about their environment. Dismissing their worries as poppycock and branding them as retarded is, frankly, ignorant. It remains to be seen what will happen with this project; it may take a hundred years before some things become evident. On the whole I think it's a good scheme but there are points for concern, such as the loss of the Met, the excessive noise and vibration of 20 trains an hour as close as ten feet from some houses (eg Ottoman Terrace, Orphenage Road), a huge viaduct across two bridges area, the positioning of the new stations etc. There are bound to be benefits too; access to the business park, an alternative to buses improved east west links in hertfordshire etc. Let's just see. Though having Boris claiming Watford as a travel hub for his London is a bit galling. TRT
  • Score: 0

11:14pm Wed 14 Dec 11

John Howard Norfolk says...

lillylurcher wrote:
I think the whole scheme is a serious waste of money. Nobody uses the trains we have! Also what about those affected by the additional trains behind their victorian houses. According to the plans there is no assistance with sound proofing or supporting the foundations of these old properties. HCC should have thought about how they spend their money a little harder than this. They have cut many jobs and reduced the income of thousands of staff because they have no money! They have but just choose to spend it on what may be the largest white elephant Hertfordshire has ever seen and all funded by the tax payer. While WBC cut a wedge between Croxley Green and Watford with their viaduct and enhance the posh areas of Cassiobury and Nascott Wood and force the areas around Whippendell Road into an industrialised zone.
Your comment ..."nobody uses the trains we have".... instantly encourages any intelligent reader of your post above to reject it as the deranged rambling of an anarchist.

This is a shame as you do draw attention to the possible effect of additional trains on the foundations and soundproofing of nearby old properties.

So by all means join in the discussion about this piece of Watford history in the making but avoid sweeping generalisations about nobody using trains. A very large number of people are not motorists - many of them young people - and improvements to public transport will be a huge help to them.
[quote][p][bold]lillylurcher[/bold] wrote: I think the whole scheme is a serious waste of money. Nobody uses the trains we have! Also what about those affected by the additional trains behind their victorian houses. According to the plans there is no assistance with sound proofing or supporting the foundations of these old properties. HCC should have thought about how they spend their money a little harder than this. They have cut many jobs and reduced the income of thousands of staff because they have no money! They have but just choose to spend it on what may be the largest white elephant Hertfordshire has ever seen and all funded by the tax payer. While WBC cut a wedge between Croxley Green and Watford with their viaduct and enhance the posh areas of Cassiobury and Nascott Wood and force the areas around Whippendell Road into an industrialised zone.[/p][/quote]Your comment ..."nobody uses the trains we have".... instantly encourages any intelligent reader of your post above to reject it as the deranged rambling of an anarchist. This is a shame as you do draw attention to the possible effect of additional trains on the foundations and soundproofing of nearby old properties. So by all means join in the discussion about this piece of Watford history in the making but avoid sweeping generalisations about nobody using trains. A very large number of people are not motorists - many of them young people - and improvements to public transport will be a huge help to them. John Howard Norfolk
  • Score: 0

12:45pm Thu 15 Dec 11

andyhooked says...

I for one will use the new link to attend WFC and even if I have to do that most hated of activities in Watford (shop). At present I use my car to go to WFC. It will be left at home when the link is open. For residents in Northwood, Nothwood Hills and further down the line the link will attract people into Watford do do their shopping and this can only be to the benefit of business, employment and prosperity.
I for one will use the new link to attend WFC and even if I have to do that most hated of activities in Watford (shop). At present I use my car to go to WFC. It will be left at home when the link is open. For residents in Northwood, Nothwood Hills and further down the line the link will attract people into Watford do do their shopping and this can only be to the benefit of business, employment and prosperity. andyhooked
  • Score: 0

12:48pm Thu 15 Dec 11

Andrew1963 says...

It is true that the Met line service is massively over provided for, but thats because it is operationally a turn back for the core central London NW London commuter service offered by the Met line. When the service runs to Watford Junction via Watford Hospital and Watford High street there will be lots of new traffic generated by the new destinations and interchange opportunities at Watford Junction. Frankly for most people commuting from watford to central london the Watford Junction and Bushey services are more attractive. Alrerady the London Overgrounds in the morning at WJ and Bushey are half empty because the London Midland service offers an alternative, but they pick up passengers at stations along the way.

the issue of impact will be subject to the enquiry next year. However the Watford Junction DC services in the Early 1960's had more than three times the current service - with trains to Broad Street, Bakerloo trains and of course trains to Croxley and West Watford. Trains today are lighter, quieter and with welded track generate less vibration. With both services operated by modern trains, i suspect these concerns will not stop the scheme.
It is true that the Met line service is massively over provided for, but thats because it is operationally a turn back for the core central London NW London commuter service offered by the Met line. When the service runs to Watford Junction via Watford Hospital and Watford High street there will be lots of new traffic generated by the new destinations and interchange opportunities at Watford Junction. Frankly for most people commuting from watford to central london the Watford Junction and Bushey services are more attractive. Alrerady the London Overgrounds in the morning at WJ and Bushey are half empty because the London Midland service offers an alternative, but they pick up passengers at stations along the way. the issue of impact will be subject to the enquiry next year. However the Watford Junction DC services in the Early 1960's had more than three times the current service - with trains to Broad Street, Bakerloo trains and of course trains to Croxley and West Watford. Trains today are lighter, quieter and with welded track generate less vibration. With both services operated by modern trains, i suspect these concerns will not stop the scheme. Andrew1963
  • Score: 0

12:50pm Thu 15 Dec 11

Steven V says...

I'm not from the area and usually arrive at Watford Junction from Euston. Does anyone know if this will allow me to arrive closer to the ground?
I'm not from the area and usually arrive at Watford Junction from Euston. Does anyone know if this will allow me to arrive closer to the ground? Steven V
  • Score: 0

12:55pm Thu 15 Dec 11

TRT says...

The ground being Vicarage Road? If so, change at Watford Junction for the Metropolitan line to Watford General (provisional name) from 2016 onwards. That's 2016 the year, not just gone quarter past eight in the evening.
The ground being Vicarage Road? If so, change at Watford Junction for the Metropolitan line to Watford General (provisional name) from 2016 onwards. That's 2016 the year, not just gone quarter past eight in the evening. TRT
  • Score: 0

2:23pm Thu 15 Dec 11

Hornet1957 says...

Certainly is great news! Thank goodness for Dorothy's government!! :-)
Certainly is great news! Thank goodness for Dorothy's government!! :-) Hornet1957
  • Score: 0

2:26pm Thu 15 Dec 11

Steven V says...

Thanks TRT. Very amusing with the year also
Thanks TRT. Very amusing with the year also Steven V
  • Score: 0

5:42pm Thu 15 Dec 11

John Dowdle says...

I hope everyone understands how over £50 million has been "shaved" off the cost of the scheme?
There will be un-staffed stations along the line of the route. How attractive is this for unaccompanied women late at night - or men on their own?
It has been pointed out that an Undergound service was provided along the DC line, extending from Harrow & Wealdstone to Watford Junction, which was closed sometime in the 1960s. This was, presumably, on cost grounds.
While it is evident that the level of population has increased since then, I still question the financial viability of this scheme, which is having to rely upon an absolutely huge injection of public capital to get started.
The ongoing revenue operations of the line will not be able to rely upon further injections of public capital.
Could we end up by seeing yet another line closure at some future point in time on cost feasibility grounds?
In the meantime, a lot of local residents living alongside or near to the line will have been put to a great deal of inconvenience and trouble due to the fact that the business case for this proposed line was never properly established.
I hope everyone understands how over £50 million has been "shaved" off the cost of the scheme? There will be un-staffed stations along the line of the route. How attractive is this for unaccompanied women late at night - or men on their own? It has been pointed out that an Undergound service was provided along the DC line, extending from Harrow & Wealdstone to Watford Junction, which was closed sometime in the 1960s. This was, presumably, on cost grounds. While it is evident that the level of population has increased since then, I still question the financial viability of this scheme, which is having to rely upon an absolutely huge injection of public capital to get started. The ongoing revenue operations of the line will not be able to rely upon further injections of public capital. Could we end up by seeing yet another line closure at some future point in time on cost feasibility grounds? In the meantime, a lot of local residents living alongside or near to the line will have been put to a great deal of inconvenience and trouble due to the fact that the business case for this proposed line was never properly established. John Dowdle
  • Score: 0

10:30pm Thu 15 Dec 11

John Howard Norfolk says...

Here we have the greatest example of civil engineering to take place in Watford since the building of the Harlequin and what happens?

Every flat-earther and Luddite criticises the idea.

Wake up people! Unless public transport links to Watford are improved then folks will choose to go elsewhere for their work, their leisure and their shopping.
Here we have the greatest example of civil engineering to take place in Watford since the building of the Harlequin and what happens? Every flat-earther and Luddite criticises the idea. Wake up people! Unless public transport links to Watford are improved then folks will choose to go elsewhere for their work, their leisure and their shopping. John Howard Norfolk
  • Score: 0

10:54pm Thu 15 Dec 11

John Dowdle says...

John: I think I am correct in saying you no longer live in Watford? You will not, therefore, really know what is happening here. With or without this link, Watford is still experiencing considerable growth, year on year.
Local schools are having to add extra years and forms. The volume of local traffic grows constantly on local roads.
Housing development approvals continue to be given, year after year.
All this growth is undoubtedly due to Watford's location within the M25 London Outer Orbital motorway and the links we presently enjoy through Watford Junction Station.
Local criticism is not being made by flat-earthers or Luddites. Most of us are enthusiastic supporters of science and none of us are machine wreckers.
We simply want to see a feasible cost-benefit analysis produced for this proposed link scheme, which London Underground and all the other parties expressing support for the proposed project have failed to produce.
What are they trying to hide?
John: I think I am correct in saying you no longer live in Watford? You will not, therefore, really know what is happening here. With or without this link, Watford is still experiencing considerable growth, year on year. Local schools are having to add extra years and forms. The volume of local traffic grows constantly on local roads. Housing development approvals continue to be given, year after year. All this growth is undoubtedly due to Watford's location within the M25 London Outer Orbital motorway and the links we presently enjoy through Watford Junction Station. Local criticism is not being made by flat-earthers or Luddites. Most of us are enthusiastic supporters of science and none of us are machine wreckers. We simply want to see a feasible cost-benefit analysis produced for this proposed link scheme, which London Underground and all the other parties expressing support for the proposed project have failed to produce. What are they trying to hide? John Dowdle
  • Score: 0

9:51am Fri 16 Dec 11

John Howard Norfolk says...

@John Dowdle...
Thanks for your reasonable comment. Yes - I have moved away from Watford but have very much experience of the town going back to watching Watford play in blue and white in the 1950's and living in Oxhey until 2006. Plus more than 20 years working in "our" town which gave me a great many local contacts. Therefore I feel qualified to comment.
And yes - we do need more capacity in schools so I do wonder why we closed Durrants, Sir James Altham, and Langleybury secondary schools? And don't get me started on the Stephenson College in Water Lane and the amalgamation of Cassio, Watford and Dacorum Colleges! All this turmoil with our infrastructure combined with business closures (Fishburns, Mirror, Cape, Clements etc etc) has confused the Watford identity.
What is needed is a reinvention to attract people to "our" area to both earn and spend thier money. They will spend their money on housing, education, leisure and shopping if public transport links are improved. And have easier links to the new Health Campus.
Roll on the Croxley Link!
@John Dowdle... Thanks for your reasonable comment. Yes - I have moved away from Watford but have very much experience of the town going back to watching Watford play in blue and white in the 1950's and living in Oxhey until 2006. Plus more than 20 years working in "our" town which gave me a great many local contacts. Therefore I feel qualified to comment. And yes - we do need more capacity in schools so I do wonder why we closed Durrants, Sir James Altham, and Langleybury secondary schools? And don't get me started on the Stephenson College in Water Lane and the amalgamation of Cassio, Watford and Dacorum Colleges! All this turmoil with our infrastructure combined with business closures (Fishburns, Mirror, Cape, Clements etc etc) has confused the Watford identity. What is needed is a reinvention to attract people to "our" area to both earn and spend thier money. They will spend their money on housing, education, leisure and shopping if public transport links are improved. And have easier links to the new Health Campus. Roll on the Croxley Link! John Howard Norfolk
  • Score: 0

10:03am Fri 16 Dec 11

TRT says...

Noooo! Don't say reinvention! They always **** stuff like that up. They're "reinventing" the high street every 8 years, and look what a mess they perpetually make of it.

There's been nothing on this scale since the Harlequin. Now, was that bad or good?
Noooo! Don't say reinvention! They always **** stuff like that up. They're "reinventing" the high street every 8 years, and look what a mess they perpetually make of it. There's been nothing on this scale since the Harlequin. Now, was that bad or good? TRT
  • Score: 0

6:45pm Fri 16 Dec 11

CockleKate says...

I wonder which German company will get the contract to build it ?
I wonder which German company will get the contract to build it ? CockleKate
  • Score: 0

9:32pm Sat 17 Dec 11

led007 says...

Reminds me of an episode of the Simpsons when Springfield built a monorail.
http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?v=jF_yLodI1
CQ
Reminds me of an episode of the Simpsons when Springfield built a monorail. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=jF_yLodI1 CQ led007
  • Score: 0

2:00pm Mon 19 Dec 11

enfield250 says...

Seems a great idea, on first view.
Then like most things, you think about it. The line from High street to Croxley Green was single track from West Watford jinction. Where will the land come from to make double track?.
Will it get as much use as the people who promote it suggest?.
Will anyone change their job, because they can go by train?.
Will it attract more companies to the area?.
I can see an advantage for hospital visits, because parking is at a premium. As for the football club, the existing met station, is not a million miles away.
Now the claim that it will re-generate Watford is rather extreme. It already seems to re-generate itself more times than Dr Who!
Seems a great idea, on first view. Then like most things, you think about it. The line from High street to Croxley Green was single track from West Watford jinction. Where will the land come from to make double track?. Will it get as much use as the people who promote it suggest?. Will anyone change their job, because they can go by train?. Will it attract more companies to the area?. I can see an advantage for hospital visits, because parking is at a premium. As for the football club, the existing met station, is not a million miles away. Now the claim that it will re-generate Watford is rather extreme. It already seems to re-generate itself more times than Dr Who! enfield250
  • Score: 0

7:28pm Mon 19 Dec 11

phil_D says...

I can understand some of the concerns about this project, but it's not as though this is a new route. It has been a rail line for longer than it hasn't, and anyone buying a property bordering the route should have considered this. I say this as someone who borders the Abbey Line and supports greater frequency on that, so that isn't NIMBYism. In terms of benefits, I can see a great many. First and foremost would be servicing West Watford and the business parks, which have been crying out for decent public transport links for years, but the bigger one for me is the potential for future Met/Chiltern services, linking Watford to Rickmansworth, Aylesbury and points further north. The link for this already exists, so it would seem to be more an issue of paths and TOC willingness. Given the recent announcement of the reinstatement of the bulk of the Varsity Line, this would open up many more east west options from Watford and the surrounding area and create much better links in the Three Counties area in general, which can only be good if the area is to compete with London. Talking of London, it might not offer a faster route to terminal stations, but it DOES provide a useful link to many peripheral locations to the west without the need to plough through zone one. Finally, anyone who believes we don't use what we already have clearly hasn't used the revamped Overground (and especially ELLX) recently. They are light years ahead of the old metro services and patronage has rocketed.
I can understand some of the concerns about this project, but it's not as though this is a new route. It has been a rail line for longer than it hasn't, and anyone buying a property bordering the route should have considered this. I say this as someone who borders the Abbey Line and supports greater frequency on that, so that isn't NIMBYism. In terms of benefits, I can see a great many. First and foremost would be servicing West Watford and the business parks, which have been crying out for decent public transport links for years, but the bigger one for me is the potential for future Met/Chiltern services, linking Watford to Rickmansworth, Aylesbury and points further north. The link for this already exists, so it would seem to be more an issue of paths and TOC willingness. Given the recent announcement of the reinstatement of the bulk of the Varsity Line, this would open up many more east west options from Watford and the surrounding area and create much better links in the Three Counties area in general, which can only be good if the area is to compete with London. Talking of London, it might not offer a faster route to terminal stations, but it DOES provide a useful link to many peripheral locations to the west without the need to plough through zone one. Finally, anyone who believes we don't use what we already have clearly hasn't used the revamped Overground (and especially ELLX) recently. They are light years ahead of the old metro services and patronage has rocketed. phil_D
  • Score: 0

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