UKIP to enter police commissioner election (From Watford Observer)

Reg, please help me out here. UKIP are about taking us out of Europe and campaigning for a referendum on the issue. What relevance does this have to the police and crime commissioner election?

Are you not just an extreme splinter of the Tory right?

This might help until Reg logs on - it's from the UKIP website:

Party Leader, Nigel Farage MEP, said that these elections demonstrate a significant step forward for UKIP: "We will not be contesting these elections on a 'withdraw from the EU' ticket, but on a better, more responsive policing ticket.

"We are talking to people about their problems, listening to their concerns and proving once and for all that we are a party that has transformed itself into a serious player, with a broad range of interests."

I actively plan not to vote in these elections. I'm a huge supporter of the democratic process but this is NOT democracy. I voted in my MP and my local councillor on the strengths of their policies about crime amongst the rest of their manifesto. You might as well just rip up the ticket for representative democracy and bring in direct democracy instead. This is an outrageous waste of tax payer funds; just what are people voting for, eh? The law is the law, it is national and the justice system is national. I don't want a crime committed in Surrey investigated by someone from the West Midlands, tried in St. Albans and that having a different outcome to it being committed in St. Albans, investigated by Surrey and tried in Birmingham!
If there is anything which could show just how out of step with reality and the people this government are, then it is this. The current government have a single mandate - sort out the economy. This is outside of that mandate. Perhaps we will see separate crime policies for the channel islands, so that all the crooks and swindlers who have shown their faces around Whitehall over the last few years will be able to be tried there and get away with a slapped wrist and a "reform" programme involving community hours scooping the leaves out of their neighbour's heated swimming pool, whilst their neighbour does the same for them?

Sanity 750 wrote:
Reg, please help me out here. UKIP are about taking us out of Europe and campaigning for a referendum on the issue. What relevance does this have to the police and crime commissioner election?

Are you not just an extreme splinter of the Tory right?

Sanity,

I am a UKIP supporter, not a spokesman but I will do my best to help you out.

UKIP is an independent party and follows its own policies on all political issues. No surprises there I hope.

It is not a splinter group of any party, although we have many members who were previously supporters or members of the Conservative, Liberal and Labour parties.

A large number of Conservative supporters do seem to be abandoning the conservative party (understandable considering Cameron's leadership, or lack of it, and his disconnect with the people of this country and their aspirations) and either giving up their vote/membership or moving to UKIP which is maybe where your misunderstanding lies.

As an independent party UKIP will be contesting votes on any platform where it believes its influence would benefit the people of this country. So far our greatest success has been at the EU elections, with growing success at local elections. Election victory at Westminster still eludes us at present but we do expect to break through that barrier in due course. We have some excellent candidates in the party.

Now, if there has to be an elected Police commissioner than let's look at whether UKIP would be of benefit to the people of Hertfordshire. Straight-talking, common-sense policing with a penchant for doing what is right rather than what is politically correct or party-driven, whilst watching the budget and seeking value for money wherever possible. Yes, I think that a UKIP police commissioner would be better for the county than one from any of the other parties that are standing.

I hope that helps with your misunderstanding of what UKIP is really all about.

If you really want to find out about UKIP, visit the website and look at the manifesto. I wouldn't expect anyone to agree with everything in it, but you may find that the common-sense approach to many policy areas may be something that appeals to you - lots of people have done just that and ended up joining us to help make the UK a better place.

This is an election that UKIP could win and I hope we do. The thought of a Labour or Liberal being elected fills me with dread and a Tory would likely only follow Cameron's lead and so would not be a voice for positive change.

I don't know this for fact, but it is highly likely the Tory candidate was chosen and parachuted in by Tory central office, not by the local party. That seems to be the way the Tory party is going, removing local democracy from the party, and so it is almost inevitable that the Tory candidate will be Cameron's puppet.

You elect the commissioner, they should work for you. The only way you will get a commissioner working for you is by voting UKIP, all the rest will be just puppets of their parties central office.

"Yes, I think that a UKIP police commissioner would be better for the county than one from any of the other parties that are standing."

Please explain. What possible difference does politics make if a car has been stolen or a house burgalled?
Do UKIP or any other party have differing policies on what to do when an old lady is mugged?

I agree political parties may differ on sentencing criminals; there is a debate to be had there for sure.

But policing? No, no, no, and thrice no again. Policing IS black and white.
Uphold the law, whatever that may be and that is where politics DOES come in) and stay in budget, whatever that may be (and again, that is where politics DOES come in).
But a commissioner will not make laws or set budgets or give sentence guidlines. It's not their job.

LSC,

I think it can make a difference. It's a personal opinion, but here's how.

If you get burgled or have your car stolen, wouldn't it be good if an officer responded to you within 24 hours, preferably same day?

A PCC could decide to make that happen.

A PCC could reorganise policing to give a better service where the public wants it.

A PCC could remove the focus on petty motoring crimes like driving 1mph over the speed limit or similar.

A PCC could I hope influence whether to prosecute or caution an offender.

A PCC could introduce common sense and relegate policing targets to where they belong.

I'm not saying it will get better with a PCC, a PCC could make things a lot worse by making bad decisions.

On balance, I am for having a PCC. I do believe it can make things better and so I will be voting.

Labour and the Liberals are traditionally politically correct and soft on criminals. A tory PCC would just go along with whatever Cameron proposes because a tory PCC, parachuted in from Conservative Central Office, would not do anything to rock the boat.

That brings me back to my conclusion that our best hope is a UKIP PCC.

If policing was black and white I would agree with you, but under government after government it has not been, and so I do support having a PCC.

To be fair on UKIP, their main ticket may be anti Europe but if they want any real chances of success they need to have policies and views on all matters surrounding the governing of this country.

"Labour and the Liberals are traditionally politically correct and soft on criminals. A tory PCC would just go along with whatever Cameron proposes because a tory PCC, parachuted in from Conservative Central Office, would not do anything to rock the boat. "

You are totally missing my point. A PCC CANNOT be 'soft' on criminals. He/she doesn't set sentencing. A PCC doesn't build more prisons or knock down existing ones.
A PCC doesn't come up with ideas like ASBOs, or over see when they are implimented.
Apart from attend press conferences, I have no idea what a PCC actually DOES.
IF it has anything to do with actual police work, then simply appoint someone who has been a police officer for 30 years. Not some numpty who failed to get elected to the local council 3 times running.

Well said, LSC.

garston tony wrote:
To be fair on UKIP, their main ticket may be anti Europe but if they want any real chances of success they need to have policies and views on all matters surrounding the governing of this country.

Garston Tony,

A visit to the UKIP website will show that UKIP has a full manifesto and policies on all matters surrounding the governing of this country.

UKIP has had these policies for many years now, however it has been the policy of our detractors in the past to paint UKIP as a single issue party which I believe it may have been in the dim and distant past.

What's more, UKIP not only has a real chance of success but are in fact coming on leaps and bounds in national and local support.

Yet another level of bureaucracy that shouldn't be needed.
It certainly shouldn't be a political position.
Instead of having a costly election i'll do the job for free. If I mess up i'll actually do the decent thing and resign.
I'll also look into the sentencing at the same time. As there's no point in catching criminals who then get lenient sentences.!
Can't see anywhere how you can become a candidate - closed shop I suppose, yet another job for the boys.

Reg Edit wrote:

Sanity 750 wrote:
Reg, please help me out here. UKIP are about taking us out of Europe and campaigning for a referendum on the issue. What relevance does this have to the police and crime commissioner election?

Are you not just an extreme splinter of the Tory right?

Sanity,

I am a UKIP supporter, not a spokesman but I will do my best to help you out.

UKIP is an independent party and follows its own policies on all political issues. No surprises there I hope.

It is not a splinter group of any party, although we have many members who were previously supporters or members of the Conservative, Liberal and Labour parties.

A large number of Conservative supporters do seem to be abandoning the conservative party (understandable considering Cameron's leadership, or lack of it, and his disconnect with the people of this country and their aspirations) and either giving up their vote/membership or moving to UKIP which is maybe where your misunderstanding lies.

As an independent party UKIP will be contesting votes on any platform where it believes its influence would benefit the people of this country. So far our greatest success has been at the EU elections, with growing success at local elections. Election victory at Westminster still eludes us at present but we do expect to break through that barrier in due course. We have some excellent candidates in the party.

Now, if there has to be an elected Police commissioner than let's look at whether UKIP would be of benefit to the people of Hertfordshire. Straight-talking, common-sense policing with a penchant for doing what is right rather than what is politically correct or party-driven, whilst watching the budget and seeking value for money wherever possible. Yes, I think that a UKIP police commissioner would be better for the county than one from any of the other parties that are standing.

I hope that helps with your misunderstanding of what UKIP is really all about.

If you really want to find out about UKIP, visit the website and look at the manifesto. I wouldn't expect anyone to agree with everything in it, but you may find that the common-sense approach to many policy areas may be something that appeals to you - lots of people have done just that and ended up joining us to help make the UK a better place.

This is an election that UKIP could win and I hope we do. The thought of a Labour or Liberal being elected fills me with dread and a Tory would likely only follow Cameron's lead and so would not be a voice for positive change.

I don't know this for fact, but it is highly likely the Tory candidate was chosen and parachuted in by Tory central office, not by the local party. That seems to be the way the Tory party is going, removing local democracy from the party, and so it is almost inevitable that the Tory candidate will be Cameron's puppet.

You elect the commissioner, they should work for you. The only way you will get a commissioner working for you is by voting UKIP, all the rest will be just puppets of their parties central office.

Reg, I have to admit I am TOTALLY against these elections and for the first time in my life was planning not to vote even though I am humbled by the ultimate sacrifice that many have made to enable us to live in a democracy. Your comments were very constructive and helpful. Perhaps you are right, in that UKIP could be positioned to drag this away from the mainstream parties. Whilst I am still not sure I will vote, if I did you may have a convert. At least on this point!

Reg Edit wrote:

garston tony wrote: To be fair on UKIP, their main ticket may be anti Europe but if they want any real chances of success they need to have policies and views on all matters surrounding the governing of this country.

Garston Tony, A visit to the UKIP website will show that UKIP has a full manifesto and policies on all matters surrounding the governing of this country. UKIP has had these policies for many years now, however it has been the policy of our detractors in the past to paint UKIP as a single issue party which I believe it may have been in the dim and distant past. What's more, UKIP not only has a real chance of success but are in fact coming on leaps and bounds in national and local support.

Isnt that just proving my point really? They do have policies on other matters but they are only known for one, and I dont know about their detractors being the cause the only time I see a UKIP politician/spokesper
son is when its to do with Europe