Football League misconduct hearing begins today (From Watford Observer)

PeteBogHorrorHornet wrote:
I suppose if we do get a 10-point deduction we will still only be 3 points away from a play-off position. Ho-hum!

PeteBogHorrorHornet wrote:
I suppose if we do get a 10-point deduction we will still only be 3 points away from a play-off position. Ho-hum!

Play-Off Pete wrote:
The quicker this is sorted the better.
Who wants to finish in the top two, then either be in - or miss - the playoffs due to a points deduction???

mattymashup wrote:
Squeaky bum time, be typical of bas to f u c k us over once more. I hope his actions were not known about by the club and we escape punishment.

Harry's Bar wrote:

mattymashup wrote:
Squeaky bum time, be typical of bas to f u c k us over once more. I hope his actions were not known about by the club and we escape punishment.

The problem is that to the Football League Bassini was the club. They wouldn't differentiate between the owner and the club.

laddie hornets wrote:
I fear the League need to be seen to 'act tough', and the fact that Bassini is no longer involved will not be relevant.

The club broke the rules, full stop.

How previous owners ever allowed Bassini to be involved defies belief.

Colin West's mullet wrote:
Witness #1: the guy who refused to let Bas have the keys to the safe.

PeteBogHorrorHornet wrote:
I guess we can hope the FL blame themsleves for allowing dirty Baz to pass their "fit and proper persons" test and will therefore go easy on us...

mattymashup wrote:
Squeaky bum time, be typical of bas to f u c k us over once more. I hope his actions were not known about by the club and we escape punishment.

a1derek wrote:
A few issues here. Baz did pass the fit and proper persons test so the FA/FL passed him fit to run a football club! Contributory negligence anyone?

Secondly, it would be hugely unfair on Pozzos if a points deduction were made as they have rescued the club and the situation would be a darned site worse for us, the FA and the FL without Pozzos. We would be doing a Portsmouth for sure.

However, there is precedent from that bunch up the road. When they got their 30 point deduction it was under new ownership that had nothing to do with the previous mis-management. They also cooperated fully with their enquiry! I hate to draw parallels with them, but that is where the clear precedent lies. It is the club, (ownership will be irrelevant) that will be punished if the commission deems punishment is needed.

Duxbury has said he thinks we should be O.K and has appeared to have prepared in detail. Let's hope he is right as it would be a tragedy to punish the club given what has happened on the field this season. Sadly though, that will have no bearing on the outcome either.

a1derek wrote:
A few issues here. Baz did pass the fit and proper persons test so the FA/FL passed him fit to run a football club! Contributory negligence anyone?

Secondly, it would be hugely unfair on Pozzos if a points deduction were made as they have rescued the club and the situation would be a darned site worse for us, the FA and the FL without Pozzos. We would be doing a Portsmouth for sure.

However, there is precedent from that bunch up the road. When they got their 30 point deduction it was under new ownership that had nothing to do with the previous mis-management. They also cooperated fully with their enquiry! I hate to draw parallels with them, but that is where the clear precedent lies. It is the club, (ownership will be irrelevant) that will be punished if the commission deems punishment is needed.

Duxbury has said he thinks we should be O.K and has appeared to have prepared in detail. Let's hope he is right as it would be a tragedy to punish the club given what has happened on the field this season. Sadly though, that will have no bearing on the outcome either.

PeteBogHorrorHornet wrote:
I guess we can hope the FL blame themsleves for allowing dirty Baz to pass their "fit and proper persons" test and will therefore go easy on us...

Only 2 Ross Jenkins wrote:
I wonder if Sir GT will be asked to give evidence or be involved in some way? He was the Chairman during this whole process - which may actually be in our favour as he is rightly regarded as a man of integrity.

gloryhornet4 wrote:

mattymashup wrote:
Squeaky bum time, be typical of bas to f u c k us over once more. I hope his actions were not known about by the club and we escape punishment.

The charge is that following the breach WFC had an unfair advantage in that the club should have had a transfer embargo on purchases, although goodness knows what we bought cost anything.

DuffmanWFC wrote:
Well if its a points deduction that is unfair on the current owners that have nothing to do with this situation!
As the club is being open and working with the football league I can't see a point deduction happening!
The club has started its own proceedings towards Baz the crook and all I see happening is a fine!
Then we will sue Baz for the fine and his miss-doings!
There is a lot worse happening in football then this so I hope the football league see seance!

gloryhornet4 wrote:

a1derek wrote:
A few issues here. Baz did pass the fit and proper persons test so the FA/FL passed him fit to run a football club! Contributory negligence anyone?

Secondly, it would be hugely unfair on Pozzos if a points deduction were made as they have rescued the club and the situation would be a darned site worse for us, the FA and the FL without Pozzos. We would be doing a Portsmouth for sure.

However, there is precedent from that bunch up the road. When they got their 30 point deduction it was under new ownership that had nothing to do with the previous mis-management. They also cooperated fully with their enquiry! I hate to draw parallels with them, but that is where the clear precedent lies. It is the club, (ownership will be irrelevant) that will be punished if the commission deems punishment is needed.

Duxbury has said he thinks we should be O.K and has appeared to have prepared in detail. Let's hope he is right as it would be a tragedy to punish the club given what has happened on the field this season. Sadly though, that will have no bearing on the outcome either.

The fit and proper is only that someone is not a disq director and satisfies AML due diligence. It is not for the FA to tell the club if someone has money etc.

The 30 points deduction for LTFC was 20 for breaches and the other 10 related to going in to admin. The cases are not the same in the backgrounds as LTFC's were far more serious.

gloryhornet4 wrote:

PeteBogHorrorHornet wrote: I guess we can hope the FL blame themsleves for allowing dirty Baz to pass their "fit and proper persons" test and will therefore go easy on us...

The fit and proper is narrow in scope and it was up to the retiring board to vet Bas.

DuffmanWFC wrote:
Well if its a points deduction that is unfair on the current owners that have nothing to do with this situation!
As the club is being open and working with the football league I can't see a point deduction happening!
The club has started its own proceedings towards Baz the crook and all I see happening is a fine!
Then we will sue Baz for the fine and his miss-doings!
There is a lot worse happening in football then this so I hope the football league see seance!

In GT We Trust wrote:

gloryhornet4 wrote:

PeteBogHorrorHornet wrote: I guess we can hope the FL blame themsleves for allowing dirty Baz to pass their "fit and proper persons" test and will therefore go easy on us...

The fit and proper is narrow in scope and it was up to the retiring board to vet Bas.

Didn't the board refuse to recommend Baz's takeover (on the basis that they didn't trust him), but the majority shareholder chose to sell anyway as he wanted out? If so, they had no control over it and are therefore not to blame.

lutondown wrote:

Mangoputney wrote:

lutondown wrote:

Mangoputney wrote:
I understand the FL's central investigation hinges on whether Bassini was actually mad. Bassini is bringing evidence to the table to verify his madness and using this as his defence - the papers sanctioning the signing of Big Chris should prove this.

No not mad just bad, will not accept insanity! Hang the F***er for trying to stiff our club.

The rather dodgy picture of Baz above - was he attempting to do the YMCA at the time? 'Young man young man you can have a good meal you can do whatever you feel' Rather appropriate lyrics i feel should he end up in prison

Where he's going it'll be...hey fat boy pick up that bar of soap......

Que Vialli.....
Insert in bottom but not Chris Bottom

In GT We Trust wrote:

gloryhornet4 wrote:

PeteBogHorrorHornet wrote: I guess we can hope the FL blame themsleves for allowing dirty Baz to pass their "fit and proper persons" test and will therefore go easy on us...

The fit and proper is narrow in scope and it was up to the retiring board to vet Bas.

Didn't the board refuse to recommend Baz's takeover (on the basis that they didn't trust him), but the majority shareholder chose to sell anyway as he wanted out? If so, they had no control over it and are therefore not to blame.

Mohandas wrote:

DuffmanWFC wrote:
Well if its a points deduction that is unfair on the current owners that have nothing to do with this situation!
As the club is being open and working with the football league I can't see a point deduction happening!
The club has started its own proceedings towards Baz the crook and all I see happening is a fine!
Then we will sue Baz for the fine and his miss-doings!
There is a lot worse happening in football then this so I hope the football league see seance!

Quite agree as WFC are playing with a straight bat. Let's hope other 'big clubs' don't start any rubbish.

WFC have got be careful who they rub shoulders with because you can be infected with the fleas of dishonesty.

Roy Stockdill wrote:
Surely the loan system is widely used throughout football and I don't pretend to understand its intricacies.

But in general terms, isn't it regarded as a good thing on two grounds: 1) It enables lower league clubs to act as an academy for the bigger clubs; 2) It enables the lower league clubs to enhance their own status by having players on loan from the bigger clubs and possibly helping them to win promotion.

Or am I being naive?

Roy Stockdill wrote:
>@ChrisBottom16 says...
7:56pm Mon 28 Jan 13

Dear Fan's. It is with a heavy heart that i have to inform you that my very good friend - LutonDown has been banned from this site for life.

He posted a comment/joke which other's got involved in and unfortunatly and wrongly it has been taken out of context.

He would just like to say, that he has enjoyed meeting a few of us and has enjoyed talkin to everyone, good and bad.

Let's all raise a drink to a lifelong, dedicated and pasionate fan of Watford FC.<

Actually I agree with you/ Much as I often clashed here with LutonDown, I enjoyed his contributions. He is obviously a passionate fan and probably more intelligent than I sometimes gave him credit for. I would call upon the WO to reinstate him immediately.

Roy Stockdill wrote:
>I don't know why people keep bringing up the fit and proper person test, the test simply tries to ascertain whether the person has been disqualified as a company director or has any previous fraud convictions, Baz didn't have either so he passed that test.<

What astonishingly short memories football fans have! It is not yet two years when it was revealed in February 2011 that Bassini had changed his name from Bazini in order to disguise the fact that he had been made bankrupt over a hotel business in Buckinghamshire in 2007. I revealed at the same time that shortly before that, his stepmother had also been made bankrupt over another pub in Northamptonshire.

I and others questioned at the time how he could have gone from being bankrupt to being able to take over a Championship football club within four years. And yet there were some on this forum who tried desperately to defend him, being the naive and gullible no-hopers some fans are!

It looks as if having been a bankrupt does not prevent someone from passing the Football League's "fit and proper person" test, but if it doesn't, surely it ought to?

I understand the anxiety and concern, given Watford's current standing in the Championship, but I think the realistic view must be, as others have stated, that any punishment will reflect on the club as an entity, not on the individual who owned it at the time. That may seem unfair to some but, hey, life often isn't fair, is it?

Roy Stockdill wrote:
>When I rang the football league complaining about Bassini not being a fit and proper person to take over a football league club, I was given the following response by the FA. "Has he followed due process in the purchase of the club's shares? If so, then there is nothing we can do to interfere with the club sale" End of enquiry. Mr Bazzini was therefore considered a fit and proper person regardless whether he was a known bankrupt. Absolutely toothless and useless. Meanwhile I like many hundreds of small shareholders lost our shares for nothing, and nobody cared a jot, least of all the FA, the custodians of the game.<

Yes, I couldn't agree more. I myself lost a fairly substantial sum of money - more fool me, I hear you cry - in Leeds United when it looked as if they were going to become a very mega club in Europe in the 1990s and that fellow Peter Ridsale was in charge, another crook. I have never forgiven myself because I thought I knew better but Yorkshire loyalty and a desire to make money got the better of me. Well, we live and learn.....!

Roy Stockdill wrote:
Tend to agree with you, stevyweavy, but I feel bound to ask in all honesty, how does this make Watford a genuinely English club?

Could some of you obsessive Watford fans actually tell me how many of the Watford FC squad are home-grown British players and how many are foreign mercenaries only here for the money and because they can't get into the Udinese first (or even second) team?

Doesn't this rather expose the hypocrisy of the whole system?

I still preferred British football when it was composed of 95 per cent British players.Today the game is run by foreign owners, foreign managers and foreign players only here for the cash, mercenaries who have no regard, loyalty or whatsoever to British clubs.

Parasites in my book!

anonymous75 wrote:
If I were to create a conspiracy theory, it would be along the following lines:

1) During the end of Ashcroft's time, Watford was the last half decent club available for purchase near to the North or West of London, other than for silly money. Arsenal, Spurs, Tottenham, Fulham, QPR and Chelsea were all owned by billionaires, the super rich and or well run companies. Watford was therefore ripe for a takeover as Ashcroft was clearly a disinterested owner.

2) Ashcroft however would not have sold Watford for a song, to the Pozzos who clearly have money, but not enough to be close to the billionaire status such as Abramovich and others.

3) The Pozzos would therefore do far better to enable someone else to buy Watford first, from Ashcroft, thereby saving them millions on the purchase price.

4) The purchase from Ashcroft by Bassini was therefore convenient to the Pozzos.

5) No one still knows quite where Bassini got his money from (other than that from the club). Might he have been a stalking horse??

6) Of course Bassini then (relatively quickly) finds a miracle buyer who wasn't interested in the club shortly before, who looks at Bassini's books and is not put off.

Of course, this whole conspiracy is a load of rubbish and is merely an entertaining story of fantasy. It should be ignored as a work of fiction and as a flight of fancy.

@ChrisBottom16 wrote:
For anyone wanting to speak to LutonDown on a sensible level you can contact him on the following email address: Lutondown@me.com or on twitter @Lutondown. But keep it civil. Roy, Boosey, Hampshire, LD say's thanks for the support!

Boosey wrote:

@ChrisBottom16 wrote: For anyone wanting to speak to LutonDown on a sensible level you can contact him on the following email address: Lutondown@me.com or on twitter @Lutondown. But keep it civil. Roy, Boosey, Hampshire, LD say's thanks for the support!

Chris, Buckler, Rinaldi, Vialli and LD amongst others. Have just asked my mate about getting a coach for the Leicester game, If the interest is there he will get one. The cost normally includes refreshments!

Roy Stockdill wrote:
Dare I interrupt this cosy little chat among friends to point out that if Watford, however well they are doing in the Championship, had beaten Bradford City in the League Cup they might now have been at Wembley on February 24? Come on fellows, give this great little old Yorkshire club a break and your support against Swansea at Wembley! The last time Bradford City won a major trophy was in 1911 when they won the FA Cup in a replay, beating Newcastle Utd at Old Trafford, having drawn in the first match at Crystal Palace's ground. Bradford City were the first team I ever watched when my grandfather took me to Valley Parade as a kid in the 1940s. There was another Bradford league club at the time called Bradford Park Avenue, for whom the great Len Shackleton played, but I don't expect many of you have even heard of them!

Roy Stockdill wrote:
Thanks, Boosey! Not too many fans today will recall Bradford Park Avenue.

I had an uncle who used to support Bradford Park Avenue while my grandfather supported Bradford City. But Bradford PA went out of the league in 1970 and into liquidation. A new club was formed and they seem to be on the way back because they are currently in the Conference North.

I wonder how many here have even heard of Len Shackleton? He was one of the great players of the post-war era and played for Bradford PA, Newcastle Utd and Sunderland, also a few games for England. A fabulous footballer but very arrogant and controversial. He was known as the "Clown Prince of Football" and in his autobiography in 1956 he had a chapter headed "The Average Director's Knowledge of Football" which consisted of a single blank page!

Roy Stockdill wrote:
Thanks, Boosey! Not too many fans today will recall Bradford Park Avenue. I had an uncle who used to support Bradford Park Avenue while my grandfather supported Bradford City. But Bradford PA went out of the league in 1970 and into liquidation. A new club was formed and they seem to be on the way back because they are currently in the Conference North. I wonder how many here have even heard of Len Shackleton? He was one of the great players of the post-war era and played for Bradford PA, Newcastle Utd and Sunderland, also a few games for England. A fabulous footballer but very arrogant and controversial. He was known as the "Clown Prince of Football" and in his autobiography in 1956 he had a chapter headed "The Average Director's Knowledge of Football" which consisted of a single blank page!

ChunkeyMonkey wrote:
Just conjecture, but maybe the confidence of the Chief Exec and others around the club in the outcome of the FL hearing could be as a result of the matter possibly being drawn to the attention of the FL by the current owners who undertook thorough due diligence.
Let's hope so.

londomollari wrote:
I have always enjoyed little exchanges with LD---even if he did call me (or my opinions) stupid once or twice. (No problem, I've gone through life being called worse!).
Come on, Wobby, re-instate.
I was called stupid a while ago on this site (not by LD!) for my opinion that we will be deducted points. I still believe we will be, as the FL will always look to set an example. Ten points, probably. I really, really hope I am wrong.

lutondown wrote:

londomollari wrote:
I have always enjoyed little exchanges with LD---even if he did call me (or my opinions) stupid once or twice. (No problem, I've gone through life being called worse!).
Come on, Wobby, re-instate.
I was called stupid a while ago on this site (not by LD!) for my opinion that we will be deducted points. I still believe we will be, as the FL will always look to set an example. Ten points, probably. I really, really hope I am wrong.

Never did, did I?
Well you must of asked for it!
Thank you to Boosey, Mango, Bottom, Bush, Hamps, Jason, Mercs Stockdill, LondonMolllari etc I'm now back from outer Siberia. It was cold, it was lonely but your letters of support cheered me greatly.
Now where was I?